Talk:Holodomor

Misleading Introduction: “Man-Made” Famine

• Point

The introduction of this article is inherently misleading. The 1st paragraph is the following (as of 24/01/26):
"The Holodomor, also known as the Ukrainian famine, was a massive man-made famine in Soviet Ukraine from 1932 to 1933 that killed millions of Ukrainians. The Holodomor was part of the wider Soviet famine of 1930–1933 which affected the major grain-producing areas of the Soviet Union."
To explicitly state that this famine was “made-made”, and then proceed to state afterward that it is generally unknown (and still is in dispute) on whether it was in fact man-made or not is nothing more than buffoonery.

• Argument

This is the second paragraph of the article:
"While scholars agree the famine was primarily man-made, it remains in dispute whether the Holodomor was intentional, whether it was directed at Ukrainians, and whether it constitutes a genocide, the point of contention being the absence of attested documents explicitly ordering the starvation of any area in the Soviet Union."
This quite literally does not make sense. In other words (this is what it states):
"We do not know if the Holodomor was made-made, as there is a lack of historical proof, and official documentation. However, a lot of intellectuals state that it so, therefore it must be."
As stated by I: this nothing more than buffoonery. We are unaware if the famine was artificial, but because so-called “scholars” agree on it, that now designates it as a fact? No.

• Analysis

I am certain all know very well that the Ukrainian famine (or so-called “Holodomor”) is a highly politicalized historical event. The reality that this famine has far more attention (on a major scale) compared to Kazakhstan famine should itself raise suspicion. The political push of this historical famine ties with modern politics today as well as various such events that are occurring right now (of which I merely mention for further points but will not focus on). Note: the Holodomor was used in national-socialist propaganda throughout Europe during the German invasion of the Soviet Union and during the establishment of Reichskommissariat Ukraine. Today: the Holodomor is still used throughout both moderate and extreme Ukrainian (and European) nationalist or Russophobic ideological alignments and movements (of which there is no reason why the imperial-core shouldn't and wouldn't use this as yet another piece of propaganda for anti-Russian sentiment).

• Conclusion

I do not deny this famine; it was very much real. However: to proclaim (as a fact) of it being “man-made” when we do not possess the knowledge nor valid proof that it was is itself unfactual. Therefore: the hyphenated compound word “man-made” in the introduction should be removed for misinformation. Correct me if I am mistaken.
Vzomegahe (talk) 3:03, 24 January 2026 (UTC)

Hello, it is man-made because it was caused by soviet policies. Even if unintentionally (Though we know, thanks to the Soviet Archives, that Stalin knew about the famine yet imposed harsher grain quotas) hope this helps ~2026-11229-98 (talk) 15:42, 19 February 2026 (UTC)

The Soviets exacerbated the famine into an even worse one through incompetence and mismanagement, but this does not mean that they created the famine in totality. There were undeniable environmental factors that caused the famine in the first place. I'd even settle for "partially man-made". TrenchWanderer (talk) 23:23, 4 July 2026 (UTC)

We already say "While scholars agree the famine was primarily man-made", which seems fine and accurate enough. Weakening it to "partially" would deviate from what the consensus/majority view seems to be. Gawaon (talk) 06:13, 5 July 2026 (UTC)

"Ɦolodoˈmɔr" listed at Redirects for discussion

The redirect Ɦolodoˈmɔr has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2026 February 7 § Ɦolodoˈmɔr until a consensus is reached. ArcticSeeress (talk) 20:43, 7 February 2026 (UTC)

Genocide

Why arent we calling a man made famine genocide? ~2026-12784-59 (talk) 07:01, 20 March 2026 (UTC)

The 2nd paragraph answers this. — Czello ^(music) 07:37, 20 March 2026 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 3 July 2026

There is no dispute that the starvation was caused by policies under Stalin. ~2026-38048-36 (talk) 18:22, 3 July 2026 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want made. Please detail the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. LizardJr8 (talk) 19:41, 3 July 2026 (UTC)