Talk:John Hunyadi

Olah János

His contemporaries called him Olah János. This is beyond any doubt. This information must be included in the article. How should we procede? Caliniuc (talk) 22:49, 14 December 2024 (UTC)

WP:CITE mainstream academic WP:SOURCES to that extent. tgeorgescu (talk) 23:06, 14 December 2024 (UTC)

Caliniuc, do you want to know better his Hungarian name than native Hungarians? Hungarian wiki: “Hunyadi Janos” https://hu.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hunyadi_J%C3%A1nos

His statue, Heroes Square’ Budapest, please consult with Hungarians that you know better that his name is not his name in Hungarian

OrionNimrod (talk) 04:30, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

The name used by his contemporaries was John the Romanian (Olah Janos in Hungarian, Johannes Olah de Hunyad, etc.) as per numerous primary and secondary sources:

• https://martelyman.blogspot.com/2012/10/
• https://www.arcanum.com/hu/online-kiadvanyok/Turul-turul-1883-1950-1/1884-76F/1884-4-1421/olah-eredetuek-e-a-hunyadiak-1423/ (caveat! chauvinistic content!)
• https://intapi.sciendo.com/pdf/10.2478/actatr-2020-0005
• https://intapi.sciendo.com/pdf/10.2478/ausp-2021-0025
• Google Books
• Google Books 2
• etc.

...Hunyadinak családi neve Oláh volt , s az erdélyi Hunyad várról , melyet már 1409 - ben uj adományban nyert , vette Hunyadi nevét...

If for some reason one finds this information troublesome, they should articulate in an scholary-ecnyclopedical manner the reservations with it. Otherwise, it is mandatory for this relevant information to be included in the article. Caliniuc (talk) 10:15, 15 December 2024 (UTC)

I looked at the 21st century WP:RS from your search: there are not many, and most of them have a nationalist POV.

I'm not saying that Pop is wrong, but everybody knows he is a nationalist and that he is doing propaganda for the nation state. tgeorgescu (talk) 01:30, 16 December 2024 (UTC)

That he was sometimes called John the Vlach is mentioned in the article. Borsoka (talk) 02:09, 16 December 2024 (UTC)

He was not Hungarian. He was a Romanian with Hungarian citizenship, as Transylvania was under Hungarian dominance(they were occupied by the Hungarians, but they were NOT Hungarians).

The fact that Iancu is Romanian impossible to counter. His name was Iancu, not Janos, his father was Voicu(a Romanian name), and his grandfather was Şerb(still a Romanian name).

He was the voievode of Transylvania as you know. The term 'voievode' is, again, Romanian. The Romanian states had voievodes. Mircea cel Batran(Mircea the Elder), in documents, appears as "Io Mircea, mare VOIEVOD si domn" and also Stefan cel Mare(Stephen the Great) appears as 'Io Ștefan VOIEVOD, din mila lui Dumnezeu, Domn al Țării Moldovei'. As you can see, both Moldavia and Wallachia were ruled by voievodes, ergo, if Iancu was the voievode of Transylvania, he was undoubtedly Romanian.

Your argument with the statue does not stand for one simple fact. In Budapest there's also a statue of Ronald Reagan. Was he Hungarian too? There's also a statue of the great Bruce Lee in Bosnia, but somehow I don't think he's from around there.

Pope Pius II, on his real name Enea Silvio Piccolomini talks about Iancu in his chronical 'Cosmographia', saying hat John Hunyadi did not elevate the glory of the Hungarians as much as he did the 'Wallachians, among whom he was born'. Even the great king of Hungary, Sigismund of Luxembourg called Iancu, before offering him(his father to be more precise) the Hunedoara domain, 'Iancu Romanul'.

It is true though that he renounced Orthodoxy and became a Catholic, just so he could get political power and high status, because under Hungarian rule there was no possibility for Orthodox men to climb up the social ladder. But this doesn't make him Hungarian, just a Catholic Romanian with Hungarian citizenship, who became the Voievode of Transylvania and Governor of Hungary. Mihneaurdea (talk) 08:50, 29 May 2026 (UTC)

Alternative names

@Caliniuc: could you refer to reliable sources stating that John the Romanian is a significant alternative name in English language literature? Please also take into account that the lead is to be a summary of the main text. Borsoka (talk) 15:23, 5 March 2025 (UTC)

Certainly. Following is an extract (p.153, n.104) from peer-reviewd academic article, concerning the John Hunyadi's ethnic (and associated political) ancestry with respect to the power plays of 15th century SE Europe: "After that moment, John ceased to be called John the Wallachian in official Hungarian records (seealso Lupescu, “Matthias Hunyadi”, p. 42). Given his time in royal service, John’s earlier designationas the Wallachian cannot be explained only by ethnic criteria in the context of his elevation to the rankof ban of Severin. He had spent too much time in Hungarian administration (fifteen years) in order forthe Wallachian designation to become obsolete prior to 1439 (still, as a court knight, from 1434onwards, he had been named Johannes Olah de Hunyad; Drăgan, Nobilimea românească, p. 424; theemphasis placed on the Wallachian was futile, as long as he was further named of Hunedoara). Themost plausible explanation seems of political nature. Once John became a high official (and real baron)of the realm (Kubinyi, Matthias Rex, p. 13), Wallachia as a “career option” was out of the question,irrespective of how meagre or strong John's ties to the Basarabs were). Still, as regent of Hungary(1447), John personally pushed for more: the throne of Wallachia (Pall, “Intervenţia lui Iancu deHunedoara”, passim). But John had to pull back and enthrone his relative, Wladislaw II."

That John Hunyadi was called "Olah Janos" in Hungarian was standard up until the 20th century, when nationalistic discourse subverted Hungarian historiography. This can easily be see in Google Books searches eg1, eg2.

This is because all contemporary sources use this formula: "John the Romanian". This evidence prompted much "analysis" by modern Hungarian historiography eg3, but this travail (stages of acceptance) is a burden only of those who choose. Best regards! Caliniuc (talk) 19:35, 5 March 2025 (UTC)

Caliniuc (talk) 19:35, 5 March 2025 (UTC)

Hi, I think you do not know exactly what are those linked Hungarian texts, just you used random google search. OrionNimrod (talk) 20:19, 5 March 2025 (UTC)

• @Caliniuc: books published in Hungarian and Romanian cannot verify an English alternative name. So, I must repeat my question: could you refer to reliable sources stating/verifying that John the Romanian is a significant alternative name in English language literature? Please also take into account that the lead is to be a summary of the main text. Please also read WP:3RR very carefully, because edit warring may have had very serious consequences, including the loss of your editing privileges. Borsoka (talk) 13:09, 6 March 2025 (UTC)

John vs. Janos

I'm not well versed in Hungarian, but at birth he wasn't called by an English name. I think it quite insulting that an important hungarian be called a name that he wouldn't have gone by in life. 140.228.255.139 (talk) 21:04, 30 March 2025 (UTC)

At birth he was called Ioan Romanul/Valahul(John The Wallachian), then Ioan de Hunedoara (the Romanian name). He took the Magyarised name 'Janos Hunyad' to better suit his pursue of power (he was an official in a Magyarised teritory, see 'Magyarization of Romanian'), reigning considerations etc. 2A00:23C7:8F80:F501:4DA6:F6F1:2E1F:92E (talk) 03:16, 6 September 2025 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 3 May 2025

Lötyögi Pityu (talk) 14:36, 3 May 2025 (UTC)

Hunyadi János születési helye Kolozsvár (ma Cluj-Napoca, Románia), amely akkoriban a Magyar Királyság része volt, Erdély területén. A pontos születési dátum nem ismert, de a történészek többsége 1407 körülre helyezi. A források szerint Hunyadi családja román eredetű volt, de magyarrá nemesedett, és Kolozsvár fontos szerepet játszott életükben, mivel itt kaptak birtokokat és kiváltságokat.

Azonban egyes történelmi viták szerint Hunyadi születési helye nem teljesen biztos, mivel a korabeli dokumentumok nem mindig egyértelműek, és más erdélyi helyszínek (például Vajdahunyad) is felmerültek. A legelfogadottabb nézet mégis Kolozsvár mellett szól, amit a legtöbb történelmi forrás, például a Magyar Nemzeti Múzeum és a történész Bánfi Szilvia tanulmányai is megerősítenek.

Ha további részleteket szeretnél Hunyadi életéről vagy a történelmi kontextusról, jelezd!

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. Cannolis (talk) 16:16, 3 May 2025 (UTC)

Category

@Caliniuc: could you please refer to academic sources that describe Hunyadi as a Romanian Roman Catholic, so we can verify the basis for your recent series of reverts? , , ? Borsoka (talk) 08:10, 14 October 2025 (UTC)