Talk:Tom Frieden

Untitled

Ancestors are racist opportunists Shortly after his 1904 arrival in Norfolk, Virginia, the Lithuanian-born Menachem Mendel Frieden opened a grocery store outside the city which served the black clientele in that area. New to America and hardly speaking any English, Frieden recalled that he was terrified of blacks “whenever I saw them, since one has to become accustomed to these black-skinned people. I had never before seen people of this color, their behavior brutish and lacking in manners.” Frieden mentioned that among his family members and friends, “The assumption was that every black was a thief and a murderer,” and described how he “shook all over with fear”: “Their faces were the faces of savages, their eyes protruding and frightening,” and “these blacks will take advantage of you when they see that you’re afraid. They steal merchandise and tell you to shut up” (pp. 230-231). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.182.83.131 (talk) 06:52, 13 October 2014 (UTC)

Do you have a source for this? Important historical information. Perhaps typical of the time but gives context for Frieden's background. JVirchow (talk) 08:05, 9 May 2025 (UTC)

Article issues

This article is written like a CV, not an encyclopedia entry. The laundry list of publications is inappropriate.

Stylistically, the article doesn't use the Wikipedia reference convention, which makes editing the article and seeing cited references difficult.

Please don't remove tags until issues are addressed or discussed on this talk page.

Why is visual editor not enabled--should be enabled to allow for wider contributions from community

Bongomatic 16:39, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

Tom Frieden is an appropriate subject for a wikipedia entry: as a high-profile figure within the world of public health and policy his background and career are an important part of the public record. The New York City Department of Health is one of the largest public health bodies in the world and, under his direction, has taken a number of innovative policy stances such as smoke-free and menu-calorie labeling, that are the subject of a lot of interest, debate and research in the public health community and in those interested in New York City policy and politics. The community would be well served by having his background information on Wikipedia. He clearly meets the Wikipedia standards for notability .

stvhamill —Preceding undated comment was added at 18:07, 26 January 2009 (UTC).

I don't see any tags relating to notability on the article page--what are you referring to? None of the article issues identified would give rise to the article's deletion. Rather, they suggest ways the article needs to be improved. Bongomatic 23:47, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

I see what you're saying, and agree. I'll look at some unmarked entries of similar public health figures, Maybe C Everett Koop, as guidance. For instance, publications should be deleted. Thanks stvhamill —Preceding undated comment was added at 19:57, 27 January 2009 (UTC).

I think that recent content changes, deleting publications, for instance, and pruning the content to focus on links to substantive policy changes and outcomes, warrant removal of the Unencyclopedic and Likeresume tags. I think the article still has some progress to make in the Wikify and Cleanup areas. If there is disagreement about the Unencyclopedic and Likeresume tag removal, I would love some more specific suggestions for improvement. Much appreciated.--Stvhamill (talk) 16:14, 6 February 2009 (UTC)

This article seems to meet the standards for wiki formatting and cleanup. It reads cleanly and is well organized with internal links. Happy to hear any feedback. --Stvhamill (talk)

Hi Stvhamill - I take it you've been largely responsable for the article. You (or whoever else) has done a lot of excellent, detailed research. You'll notice that the citation format used in the article is a bit wonky, so to speak. When you're referencing stuff, use <ref> and </ref> tags. Sadly my wikipedia skills aren't all that impressive so I'm unsure how to fix the references myself. But anyway, the work is well done. Thanks, TheFireTones 11:56, 15 May 2009 (UTC)

Additionally, this article could use a 'criticism' page so as not to seem overly biased (it takes a highly positive tone). I'll try and get on this. Thanks, TheFireTones 11:59, 15 May 2009 (UTC)

There are many things to question about his public health competence and personal life to provide balance. Questionable domestic Ebola response, inadequate preparation for Covid and pandemics, mismanagement of opioid epidemic, lack of effective gun control, silence about gain of function work, ineffective TB control strategy in India, unpopular bullying leadership style, and his criminal past. Easy to provide content if there is interest in balancing some of the text that is more about promoting his brand than the facts. JVirchow (talk) 22:06, 8 May 2025 (UTC)

The portion of the article dealing with his

Alright I've fixed the problem to an extent. All you need to do, (I may try later but I'm busy) is change the <sup> tags to <ref> tags and insert the information in between the tags (as opposed to at the bottom of the article). Thanks, TheFireTones 12:07, 15 May 2009 (UTC)

I did the first one as an example. Thanks, TheFireTones 12:08, 15 May 2009 (UTC)

I agree on the CV aspect. Not NPOV. A neutrality tag is justified in my mind. -Wervo (talk) 03:45, 19 May 2009 (UTC)

What I would like to have mentioned in the page, is possible conflicts of interest that may be present. Such as; does he have pharmaceutical stock? Is he on the advisory board of any drug company? Etc. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Robiemurdoch (talk • contribs) 00:33, 25 November 2009 (UTC) Recommend deletion of the following: "By 2008, most Americans were protected by state or local smoke-free laws,[citation needed] and more than a dozen countries had adopted them." This is not just a matter of citations needed. The placement of this sentence implies that New York's smoke-free laws influenced a national wave, when the wave was already well-established, beginning in California a decade earlier.AECwriter 05:20, 12 August 2010 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Aecwriter (talk • contribs)

I have attempted to correct an addition that was recently made regarding the Ebola outbreak. There are two major issues with this update: the first being that the citation does not lead to the information that is being cited (it leads to the New York Post home page), the second is that the information being cited is an opinion piece by blogger Michelle Malkin, not a factual article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ldd8892 (talk • contribs) 00:50, 18 October 2014 (UTC)

First of all, new comments go to the bottom of the page.

Second of all you did not "correct an addition" -- you deleted it wholesale claiming the source -- the oldest newspaper extant in the U.S. -- is "not reliable"

Third, I explained as politely as I could that removing sourced text without a valid reason is not acceptable and that you should seek consensus with other editors on the talk page. Quis separabit? 01:17, 18 October 2014 (UTC)

Regardless your citation leads to the New York Post home page, no specific article. ----

@Ldd8892: Fixed. Thanks for letting me know. Yours, Quis separabit? 02:21, 18 October 2014 (UTC)

Thank you for updating your citation. However, it appears as though this is an opinion piece and I can't find the sources Michelle Malkin used. I'm having difficulty verifying the statistics and facts presented in Malkin's article. Since she is a secondary source, are there any other primary sources you can cite? (Ldd8892 (talk) 02:42, 18 October 2014 (UTC))

Nalkin fringe attack on CDC policies has nothing whatsoever to do with the Ebola response section

Feel free to move the content to the article on the Center for Disease COntrol but her HL MEncken wannabe hit pieces on CDC policy do not bekong in the section on Ebola response. I am appalled that you even think this is an issue worthy of discussion but here you have your talk page. Since it is derogatory and from a notoriously non-reliable source and is completely disconnected from the topic of the section I reverted you r delete.Please do not now war this is a BLP and I have given three reasons for the delete. You give no rationale Wikidgood (talk) 03:07, 22 October 2014 (UTC)

The above scrawl is blatantly partisan nonsense. It does belong as it was written in response to the Ebola incidents in the US in 2014. And if it fits at the CDC article, the how can it not fit on Frieden's page as he is the head of the CDC right now during the incidents being discussed? The rest of your arguments are entirely partisan and based solely on your opinion as far as I can tell, but if anyone else wants to chime in. Quis separabit? 03:17, 22 October 2014 (UTC)

Characterization of an edit as "nonsense" is tantamount to a personal attack. Please review WP:AGF. Malkin's whining aboiut heklmet laws, tobacco, playground hazards is opinion which has zero relevance to the Ebola outbreak. None.

On my talk page you complain "if Malkin is not RS then no syndicated cokumbist is". TO that effect. Actually her blog is an prime example of why syndicated columnist blogs do not meet RS (medical) or even usually RS in general, But the deletion is all the more appropriate because it is wildly unrelated to Ebola. If you read your own source and find a quote relevant to the Ebola response try it out otherwise on [{WP:BLP]] it verges on an akost vandalistic post...mudsklinging. Wikidgood (talk) 03:25, 22 October 2014 (UTC)

mudsklinging (= Mudslinging) or muckraking?? Quis separabit? 03:33, 22 October 2014 (UTC)

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just added archive links to one external link on Tom Frieden. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add {{cbignore}} after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add {{nobots|deny=InternetArchiveBot}} to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:

• Added archive https://web.archive.org/20090416002148/http://www.nyc.gov:80/html/doh/html/pcip/pcip.shtml to http://www.nyc.gov/html/doh/html/pcip/pcip.shtml

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

• If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
• If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—^{cyberbot II}_{Talk to my owner:Online} 16:09, 25 January 2016 (UTC)

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified one external link on Tom Frieden. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20160125160859/http://gothamist.com/2007/02/15/condoms_1.php to http://gothamist.com/2007/02/15/condoms_1.php

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

• If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
• If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 07:07, 3 November 2017 (UTC)

---

I would point out that the portion on personal life is incorrect: " In 2018 he faced misdemeanor charges of forcible touching, third-degree sexual abuse and second-degree harassment, which were dropped" In fact, he pleaded guilty to the forcible touching: https://abcnews.go.com/US/cdc-director-pleads-guilty-groping-family-friend-jail/story?id=63478002

Criminal past

I am new editor. I just found it odd that there is no mention of his conviction or adjudication for his 2018 arrest for forcible touching, sex abuse, and harassment (Brooklyn). One editor erased my referenced input by claiming it has had not been adjudicated (false, he plead guilty--see my edit for source) and has had no impact. This denies the impunity that he seems to enjoy and its unseen impact on millions of women who may be facing similar aggressions. Additionally, he has been passed over by the Biden administration for any meaningful post so it has likely had impact on his life. It also likely contributed to the public's disillusionment with CDC and public health officials writ large (unproven but likely negative effect). Although controversial and personal opinion, it is clear that his CDC staff did not adequately prepare for the Covid pandemic that everyone at CDC knew was coming despite billions in resources and this was evidenced by the many documented problems with the lab during his tenure (see congressional testimonies) and the subsequent failure during the domestic Covid response (see faulty lab tests, incorrect contact tracing criteria, lack of mask requirements, poor data, etc.). His staff was mostly in place during this disastrous inital response. His domestic Ebola response was similiarly bungled. Who can forget the undiagnosed Liberian patient, mayor led outbreak investigation, failed inadequate infection control measures (see MSF critique), wandering infected nurses, lack of airport screening, etc.? Bottom line is that the Brooklyn arrest by SVU and conviction is factual and should be included. The other issues above that are not mentioned on his CV-like page are well documented but may not meet objectivity criteria. If they are of interest I could easily describe them with sources. JVirchow (talk) 21:14, 8 May 2025 (UTC)

His misdemeanor charge is already mentioned in the "Personal Life" section.

The text you added appears to have been copied and pasted directly from the sources; that is considered copyright violation. Also, some of the content is in the wrong tense, e.g. "Frieden’s next court date is October 11". Also, it contains a lot of unnecessary details, e.g. all the text about penal law and the age of the alleged victim. If you want to re-add this content, I would suggest condensing it and summarizing it in your own words.

Do you have sources saying that his charges led to him being passed over by the Biden admin and public disillusionment with the CDC? Rainsage (talk) 00:09, 12 May 2025 (UTC)

No copyright violations--referenced text from news sources. Was anything untruthful? But good idea to put it in my own words. Or someone else can edit it. This incident is part of his public life--he is a public figure and politician. Public officials take oaths and should be held to a higher standard of conduct as they must maintain the confidence of the community--it degrades our democracy and faith in public officials when they commit crimes, especially sexual assault. CDC is struggling to fulfil its mandate and these sorts of incidents damage their reputation. Sure, he plead guilty to lesser charge in exchanga for dropping the other charges but the fact remains he was arrested, tried, and found guilty. I see that the editors have protected him again by reducing the entire incident to two sentences. Less than on his work on trans fats or HIV consent. This is a disservice to the wiki community and certainly to the woman he aggressed who, like so many other women, have had to watch her perpetrator get away with the crime with few consequences. Whomever downgraded the incident, think of how you would feel if you were the woman aggressed or millions of other women who have been harassed or assaulted. Or politicians who are considering abusing their power. Impunity message is clear, even on this wiki page that reads more like a CV or promotional web page. JVirchow (talk) 06:46, 14 May 2025 (UTC)

your text is copied and pasted directly from the sources; this is a copyright violation even if you cited your sources. it needs to be written in your own words. Rainsage (talk) 07:02, 14 May 2025 (UTC)

also please read the wikipedia policy regarding articles about living people: Wikipedia:Biographies of living persons Rainsage (talk) 07:05, 14 May 2025 (UTC)

OK. I think that the addition adheres to the rules--there are multiple sources for everything in the paragraph--basically just the facts around his arrest, the incident, and adjudication. I did not include the blog post by the victim describing the incident, her experience and the damage it did and why she pressed charges as it seems to have been removed from the internet. I do not think it is biased--it clearly states that he plead guilty to disorderly conduct. There is no speculation regarding the potential significant implications of an ex CDC Director being arrested. Or it's place in the Me Too movement. Sure, it is not nice to see your arrest on your wiki page but the rest of the page is mostly about his contributions to public health (which is far less certain than the facts around his arrest). JVirchow (talk) 07:31, 14 May 2025 (UTC)

OK. I have modified the text. Hopefully it does not violate copyright while also sticking to the reported facts. Will read the biographies of living persons policy page--thank you for the link. JVirchow (talk) 07:23, 14 May 2025 (UTC)

Good questions. Public disillusionment is difficult to measure but common sense would say that every public figure arrested for crimes, especially sexual crimes, contributes to the degradation of our faith in government officials. Not aware of specific poll on Frieden arrest--will take a look to see if any were published around that time. Re being passed over for Democratic administration government posts such as secretary of health I do not have a source for that either but his media campaigns and acting as de facto shadow director in the press during Redfield's directorship suggests that he is interested in public post. Other ex Directors who are in private sector are far less involved in commenting on sitting officials performance and actions. But in the end, no source as this would have to come from Biden's transition team. JVirchow (talk) 07:42, 14 May 2025 (UTC)