Talk:Lay Carmelites

Names

1. The Lay Carmelite Rule indicates the Prior General of the Order of Carmelites (1632-1642) was Theodore Straccio. - The Rule for the Third Order of Carmel, Part I, 2:9 (promulgated July 2003) http://www.ocarm.org/eng/articles/rtoc-eng.htm

2. The Carmelite Province of the Most Pure Heart of Mary (Canada, Mexico, Peru, and the United States except the northeastern seaboard) has about 8,000 active members in 250 communities (January 2007). - Lay Carmelite Office, Darien, IL (USA)

Desertcall (talk) 04:32, 7 October 2008 (UTC)

This article should have the original title Third Order of Our Lady of Mount Carmel. Lay Carmelites should be only a redirect. In all countries this religious order have the name "Third Order of...". Thank you. 84.90.92.195 (talk) 18:12, 5 April 2009 (UTC)

Is "The Leaven" also an alternative name for the Third Order of Our Lady of Mount Carmel, or a distinct but obviously related organisation? Looking at the Leaven's website, this is not entirely clear. BobKilcoyne (talk) 06:02, 27 June 2024 (UTC)

In my understanding it is a secular institute for women based on Carmelite spirituality and life according to the Evangelical counsels, not a synonym for the Third Order. Btw, I'd like to support the the comment of 84.90.92.195 – the article should be moved to Third Order of Our Lady of Mount Carmel. Indications like "lay <something>" are rather odd, as everyone who is not clergy is lay. --Medusahead (talk) 09:01, 27 June 2024 (UTC)

Thank you, Medusahead. I would also support the restoration of the original article title, Third Order of Our Lady of Mount Carmel. - BobKilcoyne (talk) 09:17, 27 June 2024 (UTC)

Requested move

The following is a closed discussion of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the proposal was: not moved. (See also Talk:Carmelites#Requested move for related proposal.) Station1 (talk) 19:05, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

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Lay Carmelites → Third Order of Our Lady of Mount Carmel — The name "Lay Carmelites" should be only a redirect. In the Carmelite Rule this religious order have the formal name "Third Order of...", as it happens in another religious orders with lay people (eg. Third Order of Saint Dominic and Third Order of St. Francis). 84.90.92.195 (talk) 19:29, 5 October 2009 (UTC)

• Oppose Our article titles are optimized for lay readers, not for specialists; this is a textbook example of excessive precision, resulting in a long and clumsy title. Septentrionalis PMAnderson 20:26, 5 October 2009 (UTC)
• Oppose per Septentrionalis. Clear excessive precision despite a common English name. Flamarande (talk) 01:37, 6 October 2009 (UTC)
• Neutral: see Talk:Carmelites Jubilee♫clipman 17:14, 7 October 2009 (UTC)

• Comment BTW, what happened to the "Second Order"? Jubilee♫clipman 17:17, 7 October 2009 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

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OCarm, OCD, or both?

From Francisco Palau:

"After the Spanish Civil War that ended in 1939, the Carmelite Tertiary Brothers who survived were incorporated into the Discalced Carmelite friars. The Sisters are now flourishing in two autonomous congregations, both headquartered in Rome: the Teresian Carmelite Missionaries, who serve in Europe, Africa, Asia and South America; and the Carmelite Missionaries, who serve in some 40 countries around world."

This contradicts this article's basic statement that all Tertiaries are OCarm, not OCD! What about the female groups? Please urgently sort it out. Arminden (talk) 08:08, 8 September 2025 (UTC)

References