Talk:World Tomorrow

Name

The World Tomorrow vs. World Tomorrow vs. The Julian Assange Show

Is there any particular reason why we aren't use the actual title for the show? Look at any of the references or external links in the article, the name is clearly The World Tomorrow . --Skizzik^talk 17:21, 17 April 2012 (UTC)

There's two real options for what to call this article: The World Tomorrow (2012), or World Tomorrow. The first seems to be the more WP:COMMONNAME, but the latter is what is shown on the program title card: Image:Wikileaks-world-tomorrow-title-card-960x540.png. (I don't have a preference; as it wasn't clear at the time what the common name might be, the simplist was to follow the on-screen title). —Sladen (talk) 03:15, 18 April 2012 (UTC)

Sladen asked that I explain my intentions; I added "World Tomorrow (promoted as The World Tomorrow)" to forestall other people like me, who were wondering why the article was called "World Tomorrow" when all the promotional material referred to it as "The World Tomorrow." I'm not planning on getting in any edit wars, as I'm not sure myself about which title should take precedence. Trivialist (talk) 13:02, 19 April 2012 (UTC)

We can now move this page to The World Tomorrow if you all prefer. It is no longer being used as a disambiguation page, but as a redirect to this page. I moved the disambiguation page to The World Tomorrow (disambiguation) in case we needed to do this. Gregcaletta (talk) 23:43, 19 April 2012 (UTC)

There must be a precendance for this on other wikipedia pages; I would have guessed that it would be "World Tomorrow, The" — Preceding unsigned comment added by Deedubb83 (talk • contribs) 05:49, 2 May 2012 (UTC)

When indexing (in Categories) then yes, it would be "Foobar, The". In the article it should ideally be whatever is most accurate or familiar to the potential readers. —Sladen (talk) 11:49, 9 May 2012 (UTC)

FWIW, the (English language) title sequence in later episodes now reads "The World Tomorrow". —Sladen (talk) 01:37, 9 May 2012 (UTC)

• There does appear to be an alternately titled version as seen here which lends some support for the IP's position that it is called the Julian Assange Show.
  ⋙–Berean–Hunter—► 03:12, 9 May 2012 (UTC)

Oddly, I can't find any mention of that alternate name on any other website (no mention of the alternate name on the show's official website). I think there may be reason to state that the show has an alternate name in some markets - although I would prefer to find a secondary source for it. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 03:22, 9 May 2012 (UTC)

• Hulu appears to only for viewable in the United States, so I can't easily check. Assuming that Episode 4 is also 27:54 long, what do the texts at 00:32 ("The World Tomorrow" elsewhere), and at offset 27:48 ("World Tomorrow" elsewhere) read? —Sladen (talk) 03:23, 9 May 2012 (UTC)

• For the first one, it is The Julian Assange Show and I wasn't able to catch the second one (sorry). They have introduced commercials at different points. This may be a US-only title to avoid copyright issues but the World title may still be the same. It is worthy to note that Assange still says the same thing with "...world tomorrow" in the opening.
  ⋙–Berean–Hunter—► 03:50, 9 May 2012 (UTC)

• For clarity, at the point in which the presenter is saying "…world tomorrow" in the opening credits on the Hulu copy, what text appears on the screen? For the second query, at the very end of the credits (when the PGP key is displayed for ~1 second), what introduction text is displayed above it? —Sladen (talk) 12:04, 9 May 2012 (UTC)

At both points, on the screen is the text "Julian Assange Show" ... the presenter's audio still remains unchanged, just the text on the screen has changed. As near as I can tell, the only versions with this alternate text are hosted on Hulu and are only viewable in North America (possibly only the USA, not sure about Canada/Mexico). I can find no mention of the alternate title anywhere, not even on the show's official website.

It appears that the production is still under the name "World Tomorrow", and simply renamed in the USA. At best, we have enough info to state that the show is released under an alternate name in some regions - this isn't unusual to mention in articles about TV shows. But without secondary sources it would be original research to state a reason for that variance in the title. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 15:46, 9 May 2012 (UTC)

If you are able to get a screen grab of the equivalent frame to the existing illustration we could use the contrast of those to talk about alternative branding appearing in some regions/districts/broadcasts—without needing to definitely say which. —Sladen (talk) 01:06, 10 May 2012 (UTC)

The initial screen-grab is easy, will upload within the hour. The second from near the end of the video is more of a challenge due to the Hulu interface and forced commercial inserts. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 01:11, 10 May 2012 (UTC)

Here's a link for reference: File:Julian-Assange-Show-title-block.jpg. It's from the same 0:31 point at the start of the video listed on Hulu. I think this illustrates that alternate titles exist, although it doesn't confirm in how many countries or regions the alternate is used, nor a reason for the alternate title. Note: a second difference from the existing image used in the article is the watermark in the lower right of the image - I did not add this, it's already embedded in the version of the video that is available on Hulu. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 01:48, 10 May 2012 (UTC)

Assange show originally titled "The World Tomorrow" was in violation of another show of the same name which holds the Trademark and Copyright.

http://herbert-w-armstrong.com/radio/Non-HWA/1973%20The%20Financial%20Economy.mp3

http://herbert-w-armstrong.com/video/book_of_revelation_h.html

The Assange team changed the name to "The Julian Assange Show" to avert legal ramifications and monetary damages for Copyright and Trademark infringement. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.252.159.98 (talk) 06:16, 9 May 2012 (UTC)

Hi .98/Garnerted. Thank you for engaging. There is no doubt that a radio programme The World Tomorrow (1934) exists, or that was a possibly related radio programme The World Tomorrow (2004) exists. This is not what we're asking evidence of (although the appropriate articles could certainly do with that information). We're asking for citable evidence regarding a television programme that you believe to be called The Julian Assange Show (2012), as currently this contradicts available worldwide references pointing to a television programme called World Tomorrow (2012) or The World Tomorrow (2012). If you have this information relating to the naming of the television programme that this article covers, please link to it. It needs to be in a location that can be verified by both Wikipedia readers and other Wikipedia editors; for example, a newspaper article, broadcasting registration, or programme title card. —Sladen (talk) 11:44, 9 May 2012 (UTC)

The YouTube uploads you are pointing to, along with the initial press on the net for the show, are now out dated. Feel free to contact the attorney for Assange, RT and their production team. (The show now airs under the intro and end credits banner as "The Julian Assange Show", regardless of the VoiceOver reference to the phrase "The World Tomorrow" ). It IS now titled The Julian Assange Show, no matter how desperately you may personally desire to make it otherwise.

For all inquiries and/or updated press release verification of the aforementioned facts please contact: [redacted]] — Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.252.152.83 (talk) 19:37, 9 May 2012 (UTC)

Note: Don't bother constantly reposting attorney contact info. What someone says on the phone is not usable as a reference per Wikipedia policy (see WP:NOR). What matters is what can be found in published reliable sources.

From the available sources; at this time, it appears the production remains under the original name, but is aired under a different name within the USA. That should be mentioned in the article. But the existing reliable sources all appear to support that the production is still under the original name. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 19:46, 9 May 2012 (UTC)

Please provide a link. We can only go by the reputable news and other citable sources available. If you're so strongly sure that your are correct, then you need to at least meet half way and provide some sources to back it up. —Sladen (talk) 19:49, 9 May 2012 (UTC)

The SHOW itself is the SOURCE. WATCH it, PLEASE. Otherwise, you continue to blatantly present yourselves as strongly biased toward this subject by ignoring the irrefutable, FACT - the program is now titled "The Julian Assange Show".

See previously linked HULU episodes!!!! The program intro/outro has been CHANGED since the initial press and first episode airing. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.252.152.83 (talk) 22:23, 9 May 2012 (UTC)

www.hulu.com/the-julian-assange-show — Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.252.152.83 (talk) 22:32, 9 May 2012 (UTC)

http://www.hulu.com/the-julian-assange-show

The Julian Assange Show, as it is entitled in the opening banner, and end credits, should be the only source needed. Users Sladen and Barek have disruptively edited these articles often in recent months in a tag team effort to selectively and maliciously taunt. (See The World Tomorrow and Garner Ted Armstrong history pages for verification of their biased editing). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.252.152.83 (talk • contribs) 23:46, 9 May 2012‎

Please drop the false accusations against other editors. It is disruptive, and repeated such behavior has in the past resulted in blocks or bans being issued.

You continue to ignore the advice provided. Read the replies, there is useful advice given. As I stated earlier (twice above), the Hulu link does demonstrate that the name has been altered in at least one region (the USA), and that fact should be stated in the article. However, it does not demonstrate the production has changed the name - the official website still remains under the original name. Unless you have reliable published sources that state the production has changed (or until the official site makes the change on their site themselves), we don't have anything to indicate the name has been changed anywhere other than the USA. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 00:54, 10 May 2012 (UTC)

The edit history of users Sladen and Barek in this matter is not a false accusation as suggested. Their combined edit history of both The World Tomorrow AND Garner Ted Armstrong Wikipedia pages is fact, and speaks clearly of biased and selective, malicious editing. (They then "ban" or "block" anyone else who makes an edit contrary to the way they wish to "spin" the edit).

The advice given remains the same; stop referring to OUT DATED sources. Go to the representative of the Julian Assange team for the information you state you desire. I am sure the attorney for his production company and RT would be more than happy to fax or email you what you don't want to accept thus far, the FACT they changed the name of the Assange program from The World Tomorrow, to The Julian Assange Show.

The YouTube uploads you are pointing to, along with the initial press on the net for the show, are now out dated. Feel free to contact the attorney for Assange, RT and their production team. (The show now airs under the intro and end credits banner as "The Julian Assange Show", regardless of the VoiceOver reference to the phrase "The World Tomorrow" ). It IS now titled The Julian Assange Show, no matter how desperately you may personally desire to make it otherwise.

(And where did the photo of Julian Assange come from that is included with the freshly created article? It is copyrighted. Being that it is copyrighted, whoever created the article is in violation and the photo of Assange needs to be deleted per Wikipedia rules). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.252.185.162 (talk) 06:03, 10 May 2012 (UTC)

This talk page is to discuss this article, not to make false accusations that can easily be seen as unfounded by any rational person reviewing the edit history of the articles you reference. If you truly believe the specific editors are behaving inappropriately, feel free to bring it up at WP:ANI. However, be warned that I suspect you'll just be shooting yourself in the foot. If you do bring it up there, be sure to provide links to specific examples to support your claims.

The official website of the production continues to use "World Tomorrow", despite the changes to the USA broadcast on Hulu. It's not uncommon for broadcasts to be given different names in some regions. The alternate name is now mentioned within the article.

As to the image, copyright law permits a clip of a broadcast under fair use laws when used to illustrate an article about that broadcast, within very limited restrictions. You should attempt to become familiar with the policies that have been linked for your reference, rather than making unfounded assumptions. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 06:16, 10 May 2012 (UTC)

Thank you for suggesting, then that the current Assange page with the vid capture photo depicting the "World Tomorrow" banner, be immediately replaced with current vid capture pic of one with "The Julian Assange Show" banner. Also, why were you so busy editing the Wikipedia page for evangelist Garner Ted Armstrong recently, and the disambiguation pages for the World Tomorrow? It appeared to all of us here on my team your intention was to put one article down and out, deliberately making the original appear to be defunct - while elevating the newly created article of the identical Trademarked and Copyrighted broadcast name. Please feel free to explain your actions in these cases. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.252.180.85 (talk) 06:37, 10 May 2012 (UTC)

Please keep in mind that Wikipedia is world-wide, not USA-centric. All currently available reliable sources (including the official website of the show) state that World Tomorrow is the appropriate name. The alternate title is now listed in this article, as it appears to be in use in some regions, but does not at this time appear to be the primary name under which the program is produced, so should not be elevated to be the primary photo in the infobox.

I have only ever made two edits to the article Garner Ted Armstrong (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) - and that as a result of my investigating the situation following a post by you to another user's talk page about the article (and no, it wasn't Sladen - as near as I can tell from the article history, they have never edited the Garner Ted Armstrong article).

I have only once edited The World Tomorrow (disambiguation) (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views), which I had added to my watchlist following my previous edits of the Garner Ted Armstrong article.

I have also only ever made two edits to The World Tomorrow (1934) (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) - where I changed the sentence:

" The World Tomorrow television program is once again in current production and airs in Atlanta, Georgia and Knoxville, Tennessee."

to instead read as:

"The World Tomorrow television program is in current production after having resumed in 2004, and airs in Atlanta, Georgia and Knoxville, Tennessee."

which you will note is an edit which directly contradicts your claims about my motives/behavior (Note: the bolding added above was to help illustrate the changed text - those words are not actually bolded in the article) --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 07:04, 10 May 2012 (UTC)

Barek and Sladen combined have made thirty eight, (38) total edits or revisions to the above Wikipedia articles, since April 16, 2012.

Barek has made a total of five, (5) edits, revisions, to The World Tomorrow Julian Assange article alone.

1. 03:04 10May2012
2. 02:20 9May2012
3. 02:19 9May2012
4. 16:40 24April2012
5. 16:02 25April2012

Since you have now acknowleged the original programme is still in production, then immediately restore that original article to the number one position on the disambiguation page - if you are truly unbiased as to how these articles appear. The original article should retain the number one position it has held for many many years. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.134.189.5 (talk) 14:39, 10 May 2012 (UTC)

You were previously warned: This talk space is for discussing improvements to this article. However, to clear up your misrepresentation: I have made three edits to this article, the other two actions were to protect the page due to repeated disruption - not to modify content. Your claims on the disambiguation page are also false, I never took any such action - my edit there was to revert blanking of content, not to change a sequence.

Any further false/misrepresented claims will be reported. Wikipedia works on collaborative discussion and developing consensus - not edit warring and accusations. I encourage you to stop your disruptive behavior now, and engage in productive discussion, if that is your true intent. --- Barek (talk • contribs)

- 15:59, 10 May 2012 (UTC)

Look Barek, Sladen et. al; It took you all nearly a MONTH to concede the fact the program is called "The Julian Assange Show" as of the second episode. You want to be right, and you ban or block anyone who you don't agree with, or who makes a correction to your edit. It seems like you must have the final say/edit -- otherwise you complain of sockpuppetry/and cry over being misrepresented. Then your M/O has been to place a "protection template" over the page so that noone can undo your edits -- because again you must have the final edit/word. Barek's talk page is replete with complaints of this very nature from others who are upset with his interference/bullying. The FACTS are -- you and Sladen COMBINED have made over 38, whatever you wish to call them -- "corrections" to this newly created article, and the others in question, since mid April. That is NOT a false or misrepresented claim. IT IS A FACT that anyone can verify with a cursory search of your history on these pages. So go right ahead and "REPORT"/"BAN"/"BLOCK" as you have done in the past, whenever you don't agree with a topic, or get your own way. The edit warring is from you, because you had to be proven "right" when someone else told you there was another title, and you did not wish to believe it -- even after given the proof you demanded. Your behavior in this matter has been disruptive to a work of God and its television and radio outreach programs of 70 plus years -- because I have had to deal with this mess personally.

The original Wikipedia page for The World Tomorrow was extant for years, and now has been deliberately regulated to a secondary position in a "disambiguation" page that was also freshly created in order for these sockpuppets to elevate the Assange show page of the same title to the number one position, which is evidenced in any internet search engine results page.

Restore the original page to the number one spot it held PRIOR to the Assange show of the same title, if you want to correct this situation. Immediately! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.10.209.225 (talk • contribs) 01:58, 11 May 2012‎

I replied to the apparently duplicate copy of the above rant over on my talk page. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 03:48, 11 May 2012 (UTC)

Minor Changes

Why is the date presented as Mat instead of May? I am looking at the English Wikipedia. [ex: Episode Three: Moncef Marzouki (1 Mat 2012)] — Preceding unsigned comment added by Deedubb83 (talk • contribs) 05:49, 2 May 2012 (UTC)

 Done Just a typo I guess, corrected now. The User 567 (talk) 08:21, 2 May 2012 (UTC)

Episode 8

Under "List of Episodes" Episode 8 is called "cyberpunks" and link is wrong. It should be 'cypherpunks' and link to cypherpunk article. Cypherpunk, not to be confused with Cyberpunk. Sprachspiel (talk) 08:26, 6 June 2012 (UTC)

 Done . Thank you for spotting it! —

Episodes' order

The order is wrong. They should be reduced by one. I wanted to watch the Chomsky episode, which the article said it was 11, however it was actually 10. See here. Mohamed CJ (talk) 10:08, 25 August 2012 (UTC)

It's difficult to know what to do about that; depending on whether you count "Cypherpunks" as one, or two episodes. There were 12 transmissions, a week apart; and "Chomsky-Ali" was the 11th of these weekly broadcasts. Perhaps we could add a note to the article; could you suggest a wording that would be useful and understandable? —Sladen (talk) 10:58, 25 August 2012 (UTC)

I think we should count them as the show does. Episode Eight, pt.1 and pt.2 or 8a and 8b. Mohamed CJ (talk) 13:18, 25 August 2012 (UTC)

I saw the note, but I think there is still a good chance that I would have missed it. Keeping the order as in the show is better IMO. Mohamed CJ (talk) 13:20, 25 August 2012 (UTC)