Talk:Shipbuilding

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Early modern period: Europe

This section completely omits the development of carvel construction (which was not a single step process). The role of the shipwright and the introduction of mathematical techniques in design are glossed over with no explanation. Mechanisation of some ship construction techniques (for instance the introduction of windmill-powered saw mills in the shipyards of the Netherlands in the early 17th century) are not mentioned. Nor is the importance of obtaining large supplies of timber. This, of course, led to the use of iron components to replace the scarce compass timber for knees. The Dutch role as the timber merchants of Europe (importing large quantities from the Baltic) is integral to any account of European shipbuilding. The replacement by Holland of the Basque country as the major shipbuilders of Europe, followed by their decline and replacement by English and French shipyards are an important part of the story. The development of the Fluyt could be mentioned as a major innovation.

As for the existing text, what is meant by the west moved into a new era of ship construction by building the first regular oceangoing vessels? What on earth were the medieval ships that carried wine across the Bay of Biscay from France? Isn't that oceangoing?
The statement The ships of the Napoleonic Wars were still built more or less to the same basic plan as those of the Spanish Armada of two centuries earlier is either very poor use of English or a complete misappreciation of the developments over this time period.

Unless a powerful case can be made to preserve some parts of the existing section, it all has to be replaced in a substantial rewrite. ThoughtIdRetired (talk) 22:30, 8 September 2023 (UTC)

Problem source?

The source used in this article, Haywood, John (1991). Dark Age Naval Power: Frankish & Anglo-Saxon Seafaring Activity. Routledge. p. 18. ISBN 978-0415063746. NB second edition 2006: 978-1898281436 has been criticised in this review. The reviewer challenges some of the conclusions made by Hayward about the superior nautical activity discussed in the book. I suggest that this means this source should be used with caution, as it is clear that contrary opinions exist on many points made by Hayward. ThoughtIdRetired (talk) 21:31, 27 October 2023 (UTC)

History section rewrite

The history section of this article is a mess. The subject does not necessarily have a good fit with the normal periods of history. It would be a lot easier to cover it (and to read about it) if we simply told the story of each historic shipbuilding technique. Some of these would have a relatively exclusive regional slant (e.g. clinker construction is primarily a Northern European technique), some is more worldwide (e.g. sewn boats – used quite commonly before metal fastenings were readily available, but for longer with dhows, for instance) and some are primarily regionally based but with notable outliers (e.g. mortise and tenon edge joined planking is essentially Mediterranean in the Classical period, but with an interesting outlier in Southeast Asia). Included in this narrative should be the changes of types of rudders, the ever-present story of shortages of the right sizes and qualities of timber in major ship-building regions – which influences the story of wooden ship-building continuing longer in North America whilst much of Europe was developing iron hulls.

If anyone has any thoughts on this, now is the time to say so. Otherwise I will push ahead with making changes as and when I can nail down the detailed research. ThoughtIdRetired _TIR 21:04, 4 January 2025 (UTC)