Talk:Ross 308

Addition to Ross 308 page

To whom it may concern,

I am a welfare officer at Aviagen, the producer of the Ross 308 broiler chicken. I wish to openly disclose my conflict of interest as I would like to make an addition to the Ross 308 page to include details of Aviagen’s approach to breeding.

To respect due process, I have only included information that can be supported by peer reviewed scientific evidence, and which is supported by third-party citations.

I believe this will provide added factual insight into the Ross 308.

Look forward to hearing from you.

I would like to insert the text outlined below between ‘Health Issues’ and ‘Phase-out attempts’

Title: Breeding process The Ross 308 is bred selectively. Selective breeding has been used by farmers for centuries. The Ross 308 selective breeding programme involves the assessment of more than 40 characteristics, over a third of which are focused on health and welfare traits (1) (2), such as strong legs, (3) (4) (5) heart and lung health and overall fitness (1) (2). Other traits include feed conversion ratio, meat yield (defined as the proportion of edible meat) (6), meat quality (specifically reduced genetic propensity for breast myopathies) (7) (8), and reproductive fitness (1). Field data shows continuous improvements in welfare, robustness, sustainability and production (1) (2).

1. Evolutions in Commercial Meat Poultry Breeding 2. Developments in welfare of parent stock and commercial broilers 3. Genetic parameters of gait score in purebred broiler lines 4. Twenty-five years of selection for improved leg health in purebred broiler lines and underlying genetic parameters 5. Genetic parameters of foot-pad dermatitis and body weight in purebred broiler lines in 2 contrasting environments 6. Processing and preparation of slaughtered poultry 7. Strategies and opportunities to control breast myopathies: An opinion paper 8. Characterising the Influence of Genetics on Breast Muscle Myopathies in Broiler Chickens Welfare Officer 2025 (talk) 11:11, 25 September 2025 (UTC)

Follow up - Addition to Ross 308 page

Further to my post of 25 September 2025, I am writing here to notify the Wikipedia community of my intention to amend the Ross 308 page with the additions described above.

If at any point anyone has queries or suggestions about the extra copy, please don’t hesitate to flag them here.

Thank you. Welfare Officer 2025 (talk) 15:11, 11 November 2025 (UTC)

@Welfare Officer 2025: Thanks for disclosing the COI and posting here before editing — that's the right process and I appreciate it. I've made one immediate change to the paragraph as it now stands in the article: removing the sentence "Selective breeding has been used by farmers for centuries," which was unsourced and not specific to the Ross 308 (WP:EDITORIAL, WP:V). I want to flag two further concerns for discussion before making additional edits.

Sourcing and independence. Both of the main citations supporting the paragraph (Neeteson et al. 2023 in Animals, and Burnside & Neeteson 2025 in Poultry Science) are authored by Aviagen employees writing about Aviagen's own breeding programme. Per WP:INDY and WP:SELFPUB, these are acceptable for uncontroversial factual claims about what the programme does, but they aren't independent sources for evaluative claims about welfare outcomes. The standard fix is in-text attribution: "According to Aviagen, the programme assesses more than 40 traits…" rather than stating it in Wikipedia's voice. I'd suggest reframing the middle of the paragraph along those lines.

The closing sentence. "Field data shows continuous improvements in welfare, robustness, sustainability and production" overstates what the cited sources actually report. Neeteson et al. present trait-specific trends with different baselines and start dates (e.g., Ross 308 gait scores from 2016, FCR relative to 1972 or 2022 depending on the figure) — there's no single continuous trajectory across all four categories. The paper also openly discusses ongoing antagonisms including the broiler-breeder paradox and the rise of breast myopathies (wooden breast, white striping, spaghetti breast), which sit awkwardly with an unqualified "continuous improvements in welfare." I think this sentence should either be removed or replaced with something narrower and attributed, e.g., "Aviagen reports genetic improvements in selected health and welfare traits including gait and leg defects since the 2010s."

Happy to discuss either point. If there's no objection within a week or so I'll make these changes, attributing the relevant claims to Aviagen and trimming the closing sentence. Oldhar (talk) 14:50, 8 April 2026 (UTC)

Thank you @Oldhar. We appreciate your constructive feedback and are reviewing your comments. We will get back to you as soon as possible. Welfare Officer 2025 (talk) 16:40, 13 April 2026 (UTC)

Thank you for your patience in awaiting our reply. Could you please reinstate the reference to 'Selective Breeding'. This process is not unique to the Ross 308, but applies to most domesticated animals and plants. Please refer to this Wikipedia article. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selective_breeding. We concur with your other suggestions, i.e., citing Aviagen as the source of information in the two sentences mentioned. Welfare Officer 2025 (talk) 10:30, 22 May 2026 (UTC)

I don't think that sentence, or much of what was added (as written), is particularly relevant in terms of public discussions about the Ross 308. A lot of this section reads as Peacocking and marketing speak rather than a neutral description. It would be one thing if these were framed as "Aviagen claims to XYZ" on a section about what Aviagen claims, but I think putting this in a wiki voice feels decidedly less neutral

For the particular sentence about selective breeding, it very much reads as editorial. It reads as a subtle attempt at an appeal to tradition and not a neutral claim. For some comparison, other non-human animal breeds with public discussions about health issues / similar do not have similar statements. For instance, see the Pit Bull or Bernese_Mountain_Dog#Health pages TB5ivVaO1y55FkAogw1X (talk) 18:04, 22 May 2026 (UTC)

Thanks for the response @Welfare Officer 2025. I'm glad we agree on the attribution changes — I'll go ahead and implement those. :On the selective breeding sentence, I'll echo what TB5ivVaO1y55FkAogw1X has said. The point isn't whether selective breeding is widespread (it obviously is), but whether a general statement about the history of selective breeding belongs in an article about a specific broiler line. It doesn't add anything specific to the Ross 308, it's unsourced, and as TB5ivVaO1y55FkAogw1X notes, comparable breed articles don't include similar statements. The Pit Bull and Bernese Mountain Dog comparisons are apt. I don't think it should go back in. I'll proceed with the agreed changes: attributing the programme description to Aviagen in-text, and removing the closing sentence. Oldhar (talk) 13:27, 26 May 2026 (UTC)

Thank you for your feedback and your assistance. As statements have now been attributed to us, can the disclaimer box at the top of the entry be removed? Appreciate your support. Welfare Officer 2025 (talk) 13:29, 16 June 2026 (UTC)

@Oldhar Can you please add the concluding sentence as you previously suggested:

Aviagen reports genetic improvements in selected health and welfare traits including gait and leg defects since the 2010s.

Thank you. Welfare Officer 2025 (talk) 10:23, 29 June 2026 (UTC)

I will leave further edits on this page to a different editor as I now have a COI. Oldhar (talk) 11:03, 30 June 2026 (UTC)