Talk:Rider Tavern

Did you know nomination

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• ... that the Rider Tavern had the only roof garden in New England outside of Boston in the 19th century?

• Source: Gushue, Harold A. Jr. (1995-10-04). "Original 'barred' room is open to the public". Worcester Telegram & Gazette (South, Rt. 9 West ed.). p. B1.

• • ALT1: ... that Eli Wheelock built the Rider Tavern in order to sell more liquor from his distillery? Source: Perkins Cutler, Charlene (2005-12-31). "Rider Tavern makes fine architectural statement". Worcester Telegram & Gazette. Archived from the original on 2026-08-19.
  • ALT2: ... that Eli Wheelock couldn't finish construction of the Rider Tavern because he died, possibly from falling off of its roof? Source: Hultgren, William O. A Bicentennial History of the Rider Tavern 1797-1997. Excerpts available at https://charltonhistoricalsociety.com/rider-tavern.
  • Reviewed: Template:Did you know nominations/Paul E Niemeyer
  • Comment: Articles from the Worcester Telegram & Gazette are available through ProQuest in The Wikipedia Library, which is where I looked them up myself.

5x expanded by PeterCooperJr (talk). Number of QPQs required: 1. Nominator has 8 past nominations.

PeterCooperJr (talk) 23:48, 11 September 2026 (UTC).

• Reviewing. —Kusma (talk) 12:45, 12 September 2026 (UTC)
• Just about new enough 5x expansion, appears generally policy compliant. I do not like the sourcing for ALT0 (uniqueness claims and superlatives need better sources than a local newspaper). I liked ALT1 when I first read it but it is a stretch to go from the source's "I suppose a retail outlet was a logical progression" to stating in wikivoice that this was the original reason for Wheelock, who was already an innkeeper, to build another tavern. ALT3 is a bit bland (it is fine once the reader is emotionally invested in the story, but not as a hook to draw you in). I would expect the Lafayette visit or being a major stop on stagecoach journeys could supply further hooks; do you think you can come up with something about one of these? (If I suggest something, it would need another reviewer to sign off). —Kusma (talk) 13:04, 12 September 2026 (UTC)
  • @Kusma: Thank you very much for the prompt review. As you might have been able to tell, I was definitely struggling to come up with good hooks for the article. Upon further reflection here, I agree that ALT0 probably isn't the best way to go. For ALT1, maybe a better source would be the 2023 Charlton Villager article (currently reference 7) which includes "originally meant to serve as an outlet for products from a local distillery". But yeah, it might be a stretch for it to be phrased as the main reason for the construction. Maybe add a "partly", like
    ALT1a: ... that Eli Wheelock built the Rider Tavern partly in order to sell more liquor from his distillery?
    For ALT2 (assuming that's what you meant), it feels like somehow the legend of him dying by falling off the roof of the structure he was making should be able to be something interesting. Better source than the one listed above might be the 2020 Telegram article (currently reference 10) that says "During construction Wheelock died, and legend attributes his death to injuries sustained in a fall from the roof." Maybe we can kind of combine ALT1 & ALT2?
    ALT3: ... that Eli Wheelock started to build the Rider Tavern partly in order to sell more liquor, but legend says he died during the process by falling off the roof?
    Definitely the Lafayette visit is mentioned as a highlight in all the coverage of the Tavern, but I wasn't sure how to make an interesting hook out of it for someone not already vested in learning about it. But I'll give it a shot.
    ALT4: ... that during the Marquis de Lafayette's 1824 US tour, he stopped at the Rider Tavern and reviewed the local militia troops?
    ALT5: ... that the Rider Tavern hosted a celebration for Marquis de Lafayette during his 1824 US tour?
    —PeterCooperJr (talk) 14:02, 12 September 2026 (UTC)
• The new source for ALT1a is a bit better (the paper attributes the claim to a known expert, but I think it can go without attribution) even if the place seems quite fancy for something just used to sell some liquor. I can accept ALT1a, ALT4 and ALT5 (4 is better than 5 in my view but I leave this to the promoter); I think ALT3 would require further copyediting ("died during the process" reads a bit odd). —Kusma (talk) 15:20, 12 September 2026 (UTC)