Talk:Mount Meru

Merge proposal

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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Closed; merge not done at that time. Moonraker12 (talk) 20:29, 3 January 2016 (UTC)

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I strongly oppose merging Mount Meru (Mythology) and Sumeru, as in general the combination of articles on Hindu and Buddhist topics which happen to have similar names leads to confusion and the false assumption that the set of attributes belonging to one topic also belongs to the other. The myths about Meru and Vayu, or Meru and Agastya, have nothing to do with the Buddhist Sumeru. The Buddhist cosmology in which Sumeru corresponds to the three worlds of the Asuras, the Four Heavenly Kings, and Trayastrimsa is separate from the Hindu cosmology. Including a lot of Buddhist material in this article will drown out the distinctive character of the Hindu Meru. The same arguments go for proposals (like the one above) to combine Meru and Hara Berezaiti. They are similar concepts; but they are not the same. RandomCritic 16:58, 3 September 2006 (UTC)

This article DID introduce both Hindu and Buddhist concepts. That's why I am confused. I have removed the relevant content about Buddism from this article. But if it is not the case, i.e., if both Hindu and Buddhism use the same term of Meru (if Meru and Sumeru are interchangable in Buddhism), then we may need to establish "Meru (Hindu)" and "Meru (Buddhism)". --Neo-Jay 19:30, 3 September 2006 (UTC)

I strongly disagree. Buddha was born Siddhārtha Gautama in Lumbini, Nepal which seems to have been on or near the edge of Vedic civilization. Arguably he as much a Hindu as Jesus was a Jew. Just as Christianity is derivative of Judaism, Buddhism derived from Hinduism, or its precursor in Siddharta's time. Of course it is also true that as Buddhism was exported away from Indic civilization it picked up other elements. For example in Tibet it acquired elements of the pre-existing Bon religion. This seems analogous to many of Christianity's "saints" actually being recycled pre-christian deities.

It is certainly important to describe how the Buddhist concept of Sumeru departs from the Hindu concept, but it seems to me that we should not overlook commonalities. I'm favor a merged article. LADave (talk) 20:19, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

I agree. An article which, as Sumeru does, has to start with an explanation of how it is different from another is ripe for a merger. Add the complication that sumeru is not a universal buddhist name (it is meru in Burma for example) and having two different articles is unnecessarily confusing to the reader who will benefit from having a single exposition that covers all aspects of this mythological mountain. --RegentsPark (talk) 20:30, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

Buddhism..or for that matter Jainism was never derived from Hinduism. They are a continuation of the Shramana tradition which is different from Vedic tradition from which Hinduism is a derivative. The Jain, Buddhist and Hindu philosophy are quite different inspite of certain common concepts. I oppose any merging of these articles without proper understanding and debate.--Indian Chronicles (talk) 14:50, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Whether Buddhism was or was not derived from Hinduism is not the issue. The concept of Meru is common to both Hinduism as well as Buddhism and therefore there should be one article on it. Our readers are better served when they see both the Buddhist as well as the Hindu Meru on the same article and get a chance to note the differences there, rather than presenting them separately (when they are not really separate).--RegentsPark (talk) 16:15, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

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I've closed this; the merge was not done at that time. I've also fixed some vandalism by two IP editors who had altered other peoples comments a while ago which distorted the discussion. Moonraker12 (talk) 20:29, 3 January 2016 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Requested move

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: page moved. Vegaswikian (talk) 22:17, 6 December 2010 (UTC)

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Mount Meru (mythology) → Mount Meru — The vast majority of the incoming links at Mount Meru refer to the sacred mountain in Hindu, Buddhist, and Jain cosmology. Mount Meru also currently redirects here. This article should therefore be recognized as the primary target for the term "Mount Meru" and the disambiguator "(mythology)" should be removed. Neelix (talk) 16:25, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

Support - It makes sense. Thanks for pointing out.--Indian Chronicles (talk) 04:11, 30 November 2010 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Merger proposal June 2013

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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Closed; article was boldly merged by Nom on 8 June 2013. Moonraker12 (talk) 20:13, 3 January 2016 (UTC)

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Copied from Talk:Sumeru#Merger proposal June 2013 Proposal - I propose that Sumeru be merged into Mount Meru. I think that the content in the Sumeru article can be covered in the context of Mount Meru. The main reason for merge is of the concern of trans-language links. Wikipedia’s links are of one to one, and there is only one article in all languages other than English, the English version therefore should not keep two articles for other languages’ users to link to right English item. 216.58.66.164 (talk) 06:12, 9 June 2013 (UTC)

Comment - You mean "only one article" on Sumeru? Time to look up some sources... I'll have a look around. Joshua Jonathan -Let's talk! 06:48, 9 June 2013 (UTC)

Looks like 216.58.66.164 has got a point here: . Joshua Jonathan -Let's talk! 07:03, 9 June 2013 (UTC)

Weak support Merge Mount Meru and Sumeru are two names of same thing. Its attributes according to different religions can be described in different sections. Rahul Jain (talk) 07:57, 9 June 2013 (UTC)

Merge (?) - The title of article Sumeru creates impression that Sumeru is for Buddhism and Mount Meru is for all others. Indeed, it is not true. Both names are for the same thing. Even the final result Wikipedia shall keep two articles, the proper name for Buddhist Sumeru should keep same, such as Mount Meru (Buddhist). 216.58.66.164 (talk) 15:55, 9 June 2013 (UTC) The rationale to assign name Sumeru to Buddhist cosmology and Mount Meru to Hindu cosmology needs to be properly addressed, if Wikipedia wants to keep 2 similar or same items. 216.58.66.164 (talk) 05:47, 12 June 2013 (UTC)

Merge. Su is only an honorific modifier meaning "good", "excellent" etc. LADave (talk) 16:51, 12 August 2013 (UTC)

Comment Whether or not this article is merged -- from this thread, there appears to be no serious objection -- the lead paragraph needs to be better written. As of the time I write, the lead here is more concerned with providing all the names it has in various languages than explaining what it is. (I would make the necessary edits myself, but I suspect this confusion is due to nationalist POV-pushing & I'm not interested in dealing with that no-win situation. -- llywrch (talk) 20:26, 19 January 2014 (UTC)

Obvious merge. Dougweller (talk) 13:20, 21 January 2014 (UTC)

Merge - obviously. Mount Meru and Sumeru are one and same. Some Admin, please merge the page. Some major copy edits, clean-up referrencing also needed in page also. Thanks. Jethwarp (talk) 13:50, 28 September 2014 (UTC)

Merge - There is no reason to separate Meru from Sumeru, it's the same name and the same cosmologically-central role. We just need to have sections about its importance to Buddhism, Jainism, Hinduism and w/e is appropriate (Sikhism?). Ogress _smash! 23:18, 2 May 2015 (UTC)

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I've closed this; the discussion was opened by the nominator some 30 hours after they had boldly merged the articles, so there's not n much point in leaving it open. There was one objection at the other talk page (here) but unanimous support here, so the merge was accepted. Moonraker12 (talk) 20:13, 3 January 2016 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.