Talk:Maria Rickmers

Did you know nomination

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. You can locate your hook here. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Darth Stabro (talk) 21:56, 21 December 2025 (UTC)

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Abeam view of Maria Rickmers in 1892

• ... that Maria Rickmers (pictured), one of the largest sailing ships of her day, disappeared on her maiden voyage?

• Source: ...Maria Rickmers was one of the largest sailing-ship...on her maiden voyage...disappeared and is believed to have capsized" from pages 245 and 246 of The Great Age of Sail

• • Reviewed: Template:Did you know nominations/Altuntash (governor of Bosra)

Created by GGOTCC (talk). Number of QPQs required: 1. Nominator has 14 past nominations.

GGOTCC 02:47, 11 November 2025 (UTC).

• Chesapeake Circle lists her as being one of the top three largest sailing ships in the world that year as well. GGOTCC 02:50, 11 November 2025 (UTC)

The article is new enough (created November 4) and long enough (2980 characters). It is sourced, neutral, and plagiarism-free. Assuming good faith on the sources I cannot access. The hook is cited and interesting. The image is in the public domain, clear, and used within the article. QPQ has been provided. I'm assuming "Maria Rikers" is a typo? Since the article itself and all the sources mention "Maria Rickmers". -AmateurHi$torian (talk) 16:47, 11 November 2025 (UTC)

@AmateurHi$torian: OH, yes!! Thank you for pointing that out, I cant believe I missed that! GGOTCC 17:51, 11 November 2025 (UTC)

Good to go -AmateurHi$torian (talk) 13:16, 12 November 2025 (UTC)

Instability

I'm going to continue to take issue with the statement "Several of the early five-masted barques were unstable, a characteristic exacerbated when fully loaded." There is a cited reference, which I don't have access to unfortunately, but I strongly suspect that reference is in error (not every printed word is accurate...). If there was a stability problem, it would seem to be unique to the Maria Rickmers, and certainly not to "several of the early five-masted barques". Let us look at all the five-masted square riggers: France I sailed for eleven years, and was lost after springing a leak - she was last seen afloat with a 45 degree list, definately not something an unstable ship would do. Potosi sailed for 35 years, and was lost after the cargo caught fire. R.C. Rickmers sailed for 11 years and was sunk by a U-boat. Preussen sailed for 6 years before being rammed by a steamship and lost. France II sailed for 9 years and was grounded by a navigational error. Kobehaven sailed for 8 years before (probably) striking an iceberg. That's all the five-masters, and all of them had long careers with no evidence of instability. Again, I think the cited reference lacks credibibity. ~2025-32330-11 (talk) 22:55, 29 December 2025 (UTC)

Hello again! Here is a direct link to the source and page used, which is page 2712 of William Fairburn's Merchant Sail. I am not logged in and Hathitrust has no issue displaying the content. Fairburn states, "The big European sailing ships were generally criticized by commanders for their unhandiness, and the most frequent cause of disaster among them was due to lack of stability. The France I and Maria Rickmers...were very tender ships, and both came to tragic ends because of this defect." It is certainly possible for the crews of large barques to complain about stability issues without the ship sinking due to instability. Both Merchant Sail and The Great Age of Sail (you would need a free account to read the book) contain sailor complaints about poor stability and handiness regarding Potosi, France I, Maria Rickmers, and earlier American-built large barques. With the source stating the first, second, and forth 5-masted barques had stability issues, then the article's claim is supported. While information should not be speculated and only relayed based on what is stated in sources, France I sank due to cargo shifting, which made the ship unstable. This kind of accident should not happen when the ship is already stable regardless of cargo arrangement.

Do you believe this is a fair interpretation of the source material? GGOTCC 23:19, 29 December 2025 (UTC)