Talk:Kentuck Knob

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Did you know nomination

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by History6042 talk 13:31, 17 May 2025 (UTC)

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• Article history

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Kentuck Knob

• ... that Frank Lloyd Wright claimed he could "shake a design out of my sleeve" when he was designing Kentuck Knob? Source: Uricchio, Marylynn (January 9, 2020). "Kentuck Knob". Pittsburgh Quarterly.
  • ALT1: ... that Kentuck Knob's second owner "fell in love with the outside" and wanted to see the inside so urgently that he decided to purchase it? Source: Levere, Jane (January 6, 2017). "Frank Lloyd Wright's Kentuck Knob house celebrates its 60th anniversary". The Architect's Newspaper.
  • ALT2: ... that Kentuck Knob's architect visited the site exactly once for three hours, then never returned? Source: "Western Pa. offering Wright 'trinity' tour". Lancaster New Era. Associated Press. September 3, 2007. p. 10.
  • ALT3: ... that Kentuck Knob has been called "a homily to the hexagon" and compared to a ship's prow? Source: Multiple; see article
  • Reviewed: Template:Did you know nominations/Elizabeth Harcourt Mitchell
  • Comment: Thanks to Narutolovehinata5 and Rusalkii for suggesting the ideas for ALT0 and ALT1 respectively. More hooks are also welcomed.

5x expanded by Epicgenius (talk). Number of QPQs required: 1. Nominator has 720 past nominations.

Epicgenius (talk) 18:04, 2 May 2025 (UTC).

Interesting house and hooks, I love ALT1 about love, thank you User:Narutolovehinata5. I don't think, though, that the image makes clear why he fell in love, - how about the one with the stone facade? Review to be continued. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:32, 5 May 2025 (UTC)

Fine article, on excellent sources, offline sources accepted AGF, no copyvio obvious. The image is licensed, but see above. Small details I'd suggest in the article:

1. "The driveway is illuminated by a copper lamppost designed by Frank Lloyd Wright, who also designed the house." - made me smile, but I don't think it belongs in the section about "Geography and site usage".
2. Wright claimed he could "shake a design out of my sleeve" - I'm no friend of "he" in the sentence and "my" in the quote.
3. ref numbering 52-40 in "Facade" while ascending everywhere else that I saw. Epicgenius, what do you think about a different image for ALT1? Do you plan to write about the houses in the Usonia Historic District? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 19:22, 7 May 2025 (UTC)

Thanks for the review, Gerda Arendt. For (1), I moved that detail, and for (2), I changed it from third-person to first-person. For (3), I changed the ref numbers, and I can suggest File:Kentuck Knob 20190516 (28) - "Up In My Grille".jpg. Maybe I'll write about the Usonian district in the near future - I have a few more FLW projects on my radar. Epicgenius (talk) 15:39, 8 May 2025 (UTC)

Kentuck Knob detail

- ALT1 preferred. Thank you for the changes! I re-added the image I had in mind, - in stamp, size, resolution doesn't matter too much. Both images are properly licensed. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 15:58, 8 May 2025 (UTC)

GA review

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

---

This review is transcluded from Talk:Kentuck Knob/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Nominator: Epicgenius (talk · contribs) 13:50, 19 September 2025 (UTC)

Reviewer: Rollinginhisgrave (talk · contribs) 05:58, 6 February 2026 (UTC)

Hey Epicgenius, been a while since I've reviewed one of your articles. I'll have a look.

All done, over to you. Sorry for the amount of times I ask for quotes, given the article's reliance on Hoffmann I feel it would be irresponsible to just pass it by, but the article is obviously in very good shape. Rollinginhisgrave (talk | edits) 07:38, 7 February 2026 (UTC)

Thanks for the comments @Rollinginhisgrave, I appreciate it. I've addressed most of these, but for Hoffmann, that will have to wait until I get ahold of the book at the library (which will not be possible until the middle of next week at the earliest). – Epicgenius (talk) 15:58, 7 February 2026 (UTC)

I'm inclined to pass even without confirmation from Hoffmann given how the rest of the sources looked and my record with spot-checking your articles. If it isn't too much effort, if you do go and get access I would appreciate being pinged back here and a quote provided, at least for the basement question. Rollinginhisgrave (talk | edits) 02:15, 8 February 2026 (UTC)

Prose and content

• The location description is very long, I count seven. At a minimum, I would expect that Chalkhill could be omitted, and that information if relevant put in the article for Stewart Township, Pennsylvania.
  • I have trimmed the location. - EG
• "the peak of which is variously cited as measuring... this precision is unnecessary imo, if we need it, it can be placed in a footnote and otherwise the main text can say the hill is around 2065 feet (625m)
  • I put the figures and refs in a footnote. My issue with using 2065 feet is that, while this might be the average, it's also too precise for something that's no longer rounded. - EG
    • That's fair. Perhaps "the peak of which is around 2050-2080 feet?" - RIHG
      • Ironically, one of the sources you showed me gives a figure of 2000 feet. I've added that to the footnote as well. - EG — Preceding unsigned comment added by Epicgenius (talk • contribs) 15:59, 7 February 2026 (UTC)
• "The sculptures are generally made of materials like granite" I'm not sure the source is speaking to the general composition rather than elements also appearing in the garden.
  • Fixed. - EG
• "who was planning to move to Kentucky." the body spells this out well, but in the lead it is very unclear what the timeline and significance is of this
  • Fixed. - EG
• Who is Herman Keys?
  • Added. - EG
• "where they continued to farm" I assume they also retained some land to farm?
  • Yes, that was the case. - EG
• Looking at the linked source for 87 in "At the time he took the commission, Wright was either 86 or 87 years old", I don't see the claim, although this may just be on a different page. The larger matter is: isn't it unambiguous that he was 86? Initial plans were finished by Feb 1954 when he was still 86 -- are we saying he had not yet taken on the commission after finishing the initial plans?
  • I have fixed this as well. It seems he was still 86 at the time; he was born on June 8, 1867, and got the job in late 1953. - EG
• I would rather an entire link for Sotheby's Parke-Bernet, or even a small sea of blue. I can't tell from reading whether Parke-Bernet is an organization or person.
  • Done. - EG
• I would cut "This was the first time in the house's history that it had been placed for sale". This can be assumed.
  • Done. - EG
• "Jamoul in Paris" Jamoul is a house?
  • Yep. - EG
• "The house continues to operate as a tourist attraction in the 2020s. The Palumbos no longer lived there (instead residing in a farmhouse nearby), but they continued to own Kentuck Knob and were involved in the house's operation" unsure of this tense switch
  • Fixed. - EG
• "embrace the hill and at the same time open the interior space in unexpected ways", as Wright described it" Wright's beliefs are inadvertently being put in wikivoice here.
  • I don't think this is really wikivoice, insofar as the text is in quotes and attributed to Wright, but I've reworded this. - EG
    • I wrote an essay on this a while ago that I am a little iffy on, though I think it applies here: WP:IMPLIEDWIKIVOICE. - RIHG
• Bow (watercraft) a good link for prow? This was one I looked up to make sure I had it right. I suspect cantilever would be another helpful link.
  • Done. - EG
• "In the long run, the Palumbo family wanted the house to be financially self-sufficient" I notice the source is more cynical than this article presents.
  • Maybe "hoped that the house could be financially self-sufficient" might work. - EG
• "but Wright downsized the basement for practical reasons, and because he did not want a basement in the first place" I notice that you provide two sources here, but one is pretty much using the other as a reference for this statement. My read of the source is more ambiguous than yours ("Concerning the basement, Wright indicated that since the house was to be constructed on a slope, he could provide a basement, but not as large as the Hagans envisioned." does this mean that because of the slope he could both provide a basement but because of the slope it would not be as big as requested, or does it mean because there was a slope he could provide a basement but that he would not make it as big as they wanted?). Can you quote the relevant text here from Hoffmann?
  • I mention this below as well, but I can get to this later (no earlier than the middle of the week, though). Regarding the basement, it was because Wright didn't really want to excavate a basement into the slope, but I'll get Hoffmann so I can confirm. - EG
• I'm not a big fan of === Impact === as a subheading. Garnering critical reception is hardly "impact". As with Media and architectural influence. Being written about in a book is not "influence",
  • I have changed the header to "Legacy". I use the "Impact" header for many of the architectural topics I write about, but essentially, reception and media are both part of the legacy/influence/impact of an architectural work. - EG

Suggestions

• Not sure where you get the Jan 9 2020 date for for https://pittsburghquarterly.com/articles/kentuck-knob-the-other-frank-lloyd-wright/. Looks like August 20, 2015 on my end.

Oops, looks like the tool I was using gave the incorrect date. I've fixed it. – Epicgenius (talk) 15:32, 6 February 2026 (UTC)

• "more than made up for the "occasional inconveniences"." This one is probably on the wrong side of MOS:QUOTEPOV: we are putting in wikivoice that it trespassers / visitors were an "occasional inconveinence"
  • Actually, my thinking is that, since this is a direct quote from I.N. Hagan (who preferred privacy), it is specifically not in wikivoice. - EG
• right never visited the completed house prior to his death in 1959, saying that he already knew the house's appearance because he had designed it. but he did after? ;)
  • Yeah, good point. I've fixed this. - EG
• Perhaps introduce Lord Peter Palumbo?
  • Done. - EG
• I feel like I always ask you to do something way beyond the scope of GA. Here, with the somewhat abstract discussion of angles and wings meeting and lengths, I would really appreciate a diagram of a floorplan, either an official one (unlikely) or one you can put together from the description you give in prose that the reader is intended to visualize.
  • Unfortunately, I am no good with floor plans (or any visual design at all, really; it's a case of me being physically unable to create architectural diagrams). Although pre-1990 floor plans aren't protected by copyright law, blueprints still are. I'd have to see if the drawings in Storrer's book are usable, but in the meantime I have added {{external media}} and linked to the third image here. - EG
• "10 inches (250 mm) thick" This is a case of false precision. Not sure if there's a good solution here since the default measurement will be in millimetres, but 10 inches is 254 mm. On the same topic, I notice you switch between mm and cm for the conversions a few sentences later at Each of the walls is 12 inches (300 mm) thick, consisting of a 2-inch-thick (5.1 cm).
  • The {{convert}} template rounds the measurements automatically; for some reason, in this case it appears to have used the millimeter measurement for "10 inches", but rounded as if it were given in centimeters. I have changed these to cm. - EG
• "Along the facade, next to the entrance, is a small red tile where Wright inscribed his initials" did he inscribe his initials, or was this done on his behalf?
  • He did it himself. He put small red tiles on some of his buildings, where he then personally inscribed his initials. - EG
• May I suggest linking to news stories when they are hosted online rather than the ProQuest item? For instance, "Zuchowski, Dave (August 8, 2004). "Resort Luxury Goes to New Level With Falling Rock Boutique Hotel". Pittsburgh Post-Gazette. p. W1. ISSN 2692-6903. ProQuest 390863759." would be made much more verifiable if the url was added.
  • I'll think about it; these are already available on ProQuest, so these were not as much of a priority for me, but I can do it over the next week. I believe newspapers.com has copies of these stories; the Post-Gazette is planned to shut down in May, so unless they find a buyer, it may not be a particularly good idea to link to their website in the long run. - EG
    • Oh no.

Sources

• All reliable. I've been picking through lightly as I go and have found a few issues, but generally sturdy as ever. I see a few references at the Internet Archive but nothing crucial, though the last has the most interesting information. Nothing in WP:TWL jutting out on a quick glance. This article came out after you nominated this article for GA and has some good information on current management.
  • For 1 and 2, I didn't include them because they said very little that wasn't covered by the other sources; (2) has a pertinent detail about a possible International Style influence, but not much else. Good find on (3) and the Post-Gazette though, I'll add these. - EG Epicgenius (talk) 15:20, 7 February 2026 (UTC)

Spot check from this revision:

• [11a] Y
• [20] Y
• [30a] - Can you quote this, I can't access Hoffmann 2000 at the moment. Might try later.
  • For Hoffman, it may take me a while to get this from the library. I do not expect to be able to get the book within the next few days, but I will check next week. - EG
• [40] Y
• [50] - and a quote for this one would be appreciated
• [60b] - " "
• [70] N Here, the source is referring to the length of the terrace rather than its width.
  • Article: "He overruled some of the Hagans' other requests, such as... a wider terrace"
  • Source: "At the long terrace, visitors have good views of the Youghiogheny River Gorge... Mrs Hagan would have preferred... a little less of the narrow terrace."
    • The article refers to the distance that the terrace extends along the facade, which the source for some reason refers to as the "length" (I suppose they refer to the depth, from the facade to the outer edge, as the "width"). I don't really think the exact wording matters either way - the Hagans wanted a larger terrace and didn't get it in the end. - EG
      • Funnily, my read of the source is that they wanted a smaller terrace but didn't get it. That seems the plain reading of "Mrs Hagan would have have preferred... a little less of the narrow terrace" without contorting ourselves. This is the only real sticking point for me keeping me from a pass here. Are there other sources providing context that you are drawing on that I can see? - RIHG
        • Unfortunately, not even Hoffmann talked about it from what I remember. When this source was talking about "a little less of the narrow terrace", I interpreted that as them not wanting a narrow terrace, rather than wanting the narrow terrace to be even smaller. In any case, I changed this to "he overruled the Hagans' preferences for the terrace". - EG — Preceding unsigned comment added by Epicgenius (talk • contribs) 03:20, 8 February 2026 (UTC)

Thanks for accommodating me. Passing now. Rollinginhisgrave (talk | edits) 03:28, 8 February 2026 (UTC)

• • I also note in the source that it says the attic was added "years later", in contrast to the article which currently states "When the house was being built, the Hagans added an attic for storage without telling Wright about it."
    • Fixed. - EG
• [80c] Y
• [90] clock to be awful, they were purchased in Thailand but weren't necessarily "Thai".
  • Changed to "prints from Thailand". - EG
• [100c] Y
• [110] clock / N Another nitpicky one, the source says it was opened in May 2003 and the article says it was completed in May 2003. Not necessarily the same thing.
  • Fixed. - EG
• [119] Y
• [130] A quote for one too.
• [140k] clock Not sure. I see in the source "Three bedrooms extend to the northeast from the central core" and in the article "The bedrooms, leading off the hallway, are arranged in a line from north to south." Is this what is being used to support the statement?
  • I am using the floor diagram from Storrer, which has a compass rose. I have fixed this. - EG
• [160] Y

Other

• Stable Y
• Not overly detailed / broad Y (see source search above)
• No OR / CLOP clock leaning yes, pending end of spot-check
• Images appropriately captioned / tagged Y
• Neutral Y

Rollinginhisgrave (talk | edits) 06:47, 7 February 2026 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.