Talk:Genderism

Requested move 29 January 2019

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: Moved: consensus appears to be in favour of the proposal. (closed by non-admin page mover) SITH (talk) 11:57, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

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• Genderism (disambiguation) → Genderism
• Genderism → Gender binarismGender binarism

– The term "genderism" is very new to English. It's not recognized by most professional dictionaries (such New Oxford American, American Heritage, and Merriam–Webster's). Google results are mixed and often politically charged. Non-professional dictionaries tend toward the route of this "ism" as a philosophy (similar to feminism, egalitarianism). Political, activist, and advocacy sites see this "ism" as a prejudice (similar to sexism, racism). The contents of the linked articles (especially for "gender binary/ism" and "gender essentialism" have historically been in flux. This proposal will coincide with a proposal to merge the current content of Genderism into Gender binary. A145GI15I95 (talk) 04:14, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

• Support First move and merging the current article per nom._{ZXCVBNM (TALK)} 06:18, 29 January 2019 (UTC)
• Support The proposal will help alleviate ambiguity in the title. Rreagan007 (talk) 20:22, 29 January 2019 (UTC)
• This seems like a WP:DABCONCEPT case to me - a group of means of distinction that some people make around gender. bd2412 T 18:48, 30 January 2019 (UTC)
• Support 1st move per nom, neutral on 2nd. Paintspot Infez (talk) 23:04, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Edit war

Please stop engaging in edit war. Please stop accusing others of removing links. Please stop using impolite language. Please discuss further changes here, not in change logs. Thank you. @-sche: A145GI15I95 (talk) 21:43, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

Hi! I'm glad if you've decided to pause from edit-warring the link to Genderism out of the disambiguation page on Genderism. That wa a frankly bizarre thing to pursue while that article still exists at that title. -sche (talk) 21:45, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

Again, I wasn't removing the link, just the repeated word. And again, please stop making accusations. Please show good faith. A145GI15I95 (talk) 21:55, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

Wrong merge and move Move and merge

The proposal was to merge the old Genderism content (https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Genderism&oldid=880736110) into the old Gender binary content (https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Gender_binarism&oldid=880851698), and to rename the content of Genderism disambig (can't find anymore) as Genderism. The outcome of the discussion (above) was support. Why instead now is Genderism pointed to what should be Gender binary (or Gender binarism), and Gender binarism is pointed to the disambig page, which should be simply Genderism? A145GI15I95 (talk) 17:29, 5 February 2019 (UTC)^{This text was lost in round-robins, replaced with text below.}

The proposal was to merge the old Genderism content (https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Genderism&oldid=880736110) into the old Gender binary content (https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Gender_binarism&oldid=880851698), and to rename the content of Genderism disambig (can't find anymore) as Genderism. The outcome of the discussion (above) was support. It appears the move was done in the opposite manner by mistake instead (with Genderism pointed to what should be either Gender binary or Gender binarism, and Gender binarism pointed to the Genderism disambig page, which itself should be simply Genderism). I've now attempted to correct the Genderism and Gender binarism move, and I've merged Gender binary into Gender binarism, following instructions at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Merging#How_to_merge. A145GI15I95 (talk) 19:39, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

This change (https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Gender_binarism&curid=59865407&diff=881941529&oldid=881934417) appears to express preference to merge Gender binarism into Gender binary, rather than the other way (as I initially did). So I've now moved the merge and corresponding talk pages there. A145GI15I95 (talk) 21:05, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

Well, looking at this and this, it makes sense why your approach was reverted. "Gender binary," as opposed to "gender binarism," is the WP:Common name. Binarism content in the sense of discrimination belongs in the same article. No need for a split, especially when "gender binary" and "gender binarism" are at times used as synonyms. I'm not convinced that "genderism" should be a disambiguation page rather than redirect to the Gender binary article, but oh well. Flyer22 Reborn (talk) 23:24, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

I attempted a second round-robin to correct the first round-robin, but while the articles' contents, locations, and talk pages then looked good, apparently history was lost. I noted my seemingly successful attempt here earlier, but that note was lost today when an admin made a third round-robin to correct the lost histories. Notes on that work can be found here. End result: all looks even more well now. A145GI15I95 (talk) 01:52, 8 February 2019 (UTC)

Requested move 30 July 2025

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Not moved * Pppery * _{it has begun...} 19:22, 24 August 2025 (UTC) * Pppery * _{it has begun...} 19:22, 24 August 2025 (UTC)

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Genderism → Genderism (disambiguation)Genderism (disambiguation) – Move Genderism to Genderism (disambiguation) so that Genderism can be redirected (as a tagged non-neutral term redirect) to Anti-gender movement#Terminology as a WP:PTOPIC primary redirect for most commonly used application of the term per WP:PT1 on usage, that is predominantly used as a pejorative used by the Anti-gender movement, alongside "gender ideology" and other dog-whistle terms. Note that there are no incoming links to Genderism, given its non-neutral nature to begin with, which only serves as a search term. Most people looking for Genderism are looking for the reference to the anti-gender movement. Refer to Wikinav: Genderism, which shows most people searching for Genderism and landing on the DAB page are looking for the anti-gender movement and go there at > 65%. No one in the past two months actually went to the other alternative term of Cisgenderism or Sexism, which is the 3rd term listed at the DAB page, (which used to have a hatnote for "distinguish from", so it is a bit of a contradiction for the DAB page to then point back to right there), so it arguably seems to have no disambiguating value seeking by users either, but we could keep it on the parenthetical DAB page just for the historic context, or alternatively if we say that that usage of the term is even farther away than the gender binary 1970s-2000 use of the term, we may otherwise have a WP:2DAB situation, and would just have a hat note at the new redirect target at Anti-gender movement#Terminology to point to the second older historic application of Cisgenderism use of the term. Some sources on the history context on how the term evolved from its neutral origin used in science, to the now predominant use linked to the anti-gender movement and general discussion of the topic (there are of course tons more sources, but I figured picking out at least some for users who may come here without context, it may be helpful). Small sidenote: Raladic (talk) 05:29, 30 July 2025 (UTC) — Relisting. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 06:15, 6 August 2025 (UTC) — Relisting. TarnishedPath^talk 05:44, 16 August 2025 (UTC)

Note: WikiProject Sexology and sexuality and WikiProject LGBTQ+ studies have been notified of this discussion. Raladic (talk) 05:30, 30 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose. Without repeating my comment in the AfD, I am unconvinced that the anti-gender meaning (synonym of "gender ideology") is sufficiently Primary compared to the sociology meaning (synonym of "cissexism"). The Sage entry notes all three possible meanings for the term. Given their relative values, genderism seems more prevalent in trans studies articles, while articles about the anti-gender movement tend to describe it with anti-genderism. –RoxySaunders 🏳️‍⚧️ (talk • stalk) 23:02, 3 August 2025 (UTC)

The criteria for WP:PT1 is satisfied as I mentioned above. 2/3rds of people using the DAB page to go somewhere more specific do so by following through to the anti-gender meaning. That is typically a pretty clear cut for a primary redirect with a parenthetical DAB page linked in the hat note.

Also note that on further review of the wikinav flow of the incoming traffic, most non-search traffic came from Sexism, which you had removed the hat note from, so I restored it to help people get to where they tried to go. Raladic (talk) 23:16, 3 August 2025 (UTC)

Genderism is its own topic among other language wikis, and it describes a discrimination rather than "gender ideology". Scholarly, it refers to gender binarism and gender roles as ideologies or prejudices. So, add {Dabconcept} to the disambiguation or transform it into a set index. Fy Javan (talk) 14:08, 8 August 2025 (UTC) — Fy Javan (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.

• Comment. Re the second sidenote starting with Please don't get confused by the current closing comment at the AFD ...: You will not be confused by this non-admin's closing statement, since there is nothing confusing about my correct and clear closing statement, and it being the correct closing statement explaining my correct close, there is nothing about it that may be corrected. Therefore, do participate in this RM on its own merits, and feel unburdened of the RM nominator's concerns related to that AfD and unrelated to this RM, which should not be your concerns. About the proposal: Oppose. WikiNav counts only 35 outgoing pageviews against 370 incoming, which might mean that the dab was used as a dictionary entry and the reader intent was nebulous and non-differentiated (not knowing what the word means). 22 outgoing on 370 incoming pageviews does not to me look like evidence that a topic is more likely than all the other topics combined to be the topic sought when a reader searches for the term. I don't deny that the meaning indicated by the nominator has significant prominence, but considering wikidata:Q2797937 as one other major meaning, there is at least some conflict between a topic of potential primary usage and one of potential primary long-term significance, which to me suggests that the naming scheme should not change. I think that Fy Javan's suggstions are good.—Alalch E. 12:13, 10 August 2025 (UTC)

References

Notes

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.