Talk:Gakhars

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 7 February 2026

The Gakhar (or Ghakhar) tribe is a historical, aristocratic, and warlike clan from the Pothohar Plateau in Punjab, Pakistan, known for their power in the region between the Jhelum and Indus rivers, with origins sometimes linked to ancient Iran Axealotle122 (talk) 08:01, 7 February 2026 (UTC)

My idea is to add this as a summary at the beginning Axealotle122 (talk) 08:02, 7 February 2026 (UTC)

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want made. Day Creature (talk) 22:33, 7 February 2026 (UTC)

Proposed merge of Kayani Ghakar into Gakhars

It is written that "... Kiani, is a title used by Gakhars", so it should have a brief mention in the article Gakhars rather than having a separate article. Veritasphere (talk) 03:07, 23 February 2026 (UTC)

  Y Merge completed Klbrain (talk) 11:19, 29 March 2026 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 12 April 2026

Add the following to the "Origins" section: Mr. A. Brandreth adopted the local tradition, that the Gakkhars 'came from Persia through Kashmir,' which is still the claim of the majority of the Gakkhars themselves. The views of General Cunningham are set forth at length in his Archaeological Survey Reports, II, pp. 22 to 33, to which the curious must be referred for the detailed reasons on which he basis his conclusion, that the Gakkhars represent the 'savage Gargaridae' of Dionysius the Geographer, (who wrote probably in the 4th Century A. D.), and are descendants of the great Yuechi Scythians, who entered India from the North- West in the early centuries of the Christian era.

Add the following citation at the end of the paragraph:

Rose, H. A. (1911). A Glossary of the Tribes and Castes of the Punjab and North-West Frontier Province. Vol. 2. p. 274. Kharal1 (talk) 10:15, 12 April 2026 (UTC)

 Not done: Caste sources written during the British Raj aren't reliable sources, see WP:RAJ for more information. InfernoHues (talk) 18:58, 12 April 2026 (UTC)

That is understood, however, in this context, the account of the Gakkhars’ origins can be included with appropriate attribution. A. Brandreth explicitly notes that the claim of a Persian origin via Kashmir derives from local Gakkhar tradition itself, which indicates that the source is preserving a local narrative rather than imposing one. Kharal1 (talk) 11:22, 13 April 2026 (UTC)

No, that's not how it works. See this comment for a deeper explanation of the problems involved in using Raj sources. InfernoHues (talk) 15:52, 13 April 2026 (UTC)

I see. There is also a colonial quote by M. A. Sherring in the page. Could you remove that then, if this is the case? Kharal1 (talk) 12:15, 14 April 2026 (UTC)

 Done InfernoHues (talk) 01:31, 15 April 2026 (UTC)

Could you include this where relevant?

During the mid-16th century, the Gakhars became involved in conflicts between the Sur Empire and rebellious Afghan groups when Azam Humayun (Haibat Khan) and other Niazi leaders drove Khawaja Vais Sherauni back to Lahore from Rohtas; Islam Shah Sur responded by sending reinforcements, and Khawaja Vais Sherauni defeated the Niazis near Dinkot, forcing them to seek refuge with the Gakhars. This alliance posed a serious challenge, particularly as Humayun’s position in Afghanistan had grown stronger, prompting Islam Shah to lead a major campaign against them; between 1548 and 1550, he repeatedly invaded Gakhar territory but failed to subdue the tribe. Although the Gakhars sheltered the Niazis, the prolonged conflict strained their resources, and the Niazis eventually found it difficult to remain indefinitely under their protection as their hosts grew weary of supporting them.

Source: Nijjar, B. S. (1968). Punjab under the Great Mughals (1526–1707 A.D.). Thacker & Co. Ltd. https://ia601401.us.archive.org/31/items/in.ernet.dli.2015.111045/2015.111045.Panjab-Under-The-Great-Mughals_text.pdf Kharal1 (talk) 12:26, 14 April 2026 (UTC)

Can you give page numbers for the information? The source itself looks ok. InfernoHues (talk) 01:33, 15 April 2026 (UTC)

page 26 or 27 Kharal1 (talk) 15:36, 15 April 2026 (UTC)

See WP:CLOP. Your wording is almost a copy of the source. Can you please rewrite it in your own words? Because of copyright laws I can't use that wording. InfernoHues (talk) 18:52, 15 April 2026 (UTC)

hi I'm not the person who proposed the change but I'm willing to do it, is that fine? Raja.Nadir.Jan.Kiani (talk) 16:19, 17 April 2026 (UTC)

Sure, no problem. InfernoHues (talk) 20:21, 17 April 2026 (UTC)

Raja.Nadir.Jan.Kiani (talk) 05:15, 18 April 2026 (UTC)

During the mid-16th century, the Gakhars became entangled in conflicts between the Sur Empire and rebellious Afghan groups. Azam Humayun (Haibat Khan), along with other Niazi chiefs, drove Khawaja Vais Sherauni from Rohtas back to Lahore. In response, Islam Shah Sur sent Raja.Nadir.Jan.Kiani (talk) 05:16, 18 April 2026 (UTC)

I think you forgot to send the other half. Also, that's still basically the same wording as the source. InfernoHues (talk) 07:27, 18 April 2026 (UTC)

In the mid-1500s, the Gakhars became entangled in struggles involving the Sur Empire and dissident Afghan factions. Azam Humayun (also known as Haibat Khan) and other Niazi chiefs forced Khawaja Vais Sherauni to retreat from Rohtas toward Lahore. In response, Islam Shah Sur dispatched additional forces, enabling Sherauni to defeat the Niazis near Dinkot. After this setback, the Niazis sought refuge with the Gakhars, creating a potentially dangerous alliance.

As Humayun’s influence in Afghanistan continued to grow, Islam Shah viewed the situation as a significant threat and launched a series of campaigns against the Gakhars between 1548 and 1550. Despite repeated incursions into their territory, he was unable to bring them under control. Although the Gakhars initially provided protection to the Niazis, the ongoing conflict placed increasing pressure on their resources. Over time, sustaining their guests became difficult, and the arrangement grew less viable as the Gakhars became strained by the burden. Kharal1 (talk) 07:53, 18 April 2026 (UTC)

@InfernoHues Kharal1 (talk) 11:41, 21 April 2026 (UTC)

Sorry I missed your response. That's still close paraphrasing. I'd suggest WP:FIXCLOSEPARA for some tips on how to fix the writing. InfernoHues (talk) 21:47, 21 April 2026 (UTC)