Talk:Dmitry Rogozin

About the Rogozin with Mladic photo

I checked the page history recently and I noted that someone deletd the photo of Dmitry Rogozin with Ratko Mladic because the presence of the photo would imply "incrimination by association"and thus it would be "unacccptable" for the NPOV of the article.

Well, I don't think that's the case, since the photo and this origins — Rogozin's own official website — clearly shows that he met Mladic in Sarajevo in 1996, and he is in no way ashamed of that.

Anyway, I don't think Wikipedia articles must "preserve" the identities of anyone depicted here; as long as the fact is true, it must be presented. That is the NPOVest way to do things. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 201.27.76.222 (talk) 15:44, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

Neutral?

It seems like the article was written to criticize Dmitry Rogozin. It cites mainly his political controversials: Ukrainian nationalists, Russian liberals... Dmitry Rogozin is a very well-known and popular person in Russia. Adrog21 (talk) 15:11, 29 January 2011 (UTC)

U.S. Should Send Astronauts To Space Station By Trampoline

U.S. Can Go To Space 'With A Trampoline' 2.180.114.120 (talk) 04:14, 2 May 2014 (UTC)

Rogozin is in the hospital; shot himself in the leg with a firearm

According to a news article in Lenta.ru, Dmitry Rogozin is in the hospital after shooting himself in the leg with a firearm at a training event of some sort. He's expected to recover. News article: (in Russian), 29 December 2015.

Here is a translation in English: Rogozin shot himself in the leg, Lenta.ru, translated, 29 December 2015.

Cheers. N2e (talk) 00:51, 30 December 2015 (UTC)

External links modified

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Corruption

Rogozin is one of the most corrupted russian politicians. Need more critics. https://transparency.org.ru/special/rogozin/eng/

Rozogin's probable fascist past

There exist lots of multiple sources, photos and videos of Rogozin performing fascist salutes while holding white nationalist cardboards in the 90's as well as him giving speeches in nazi rallies in the 2000's. I've tried adding them previously yet they were regarded as "low-quality sources" or "unreliable sources", labels with which I disagree with.

Should I add this information in his "Personal life"? If so, which out of all these sources are considered reliable and suitable to be added to the article? Also, once this information is added, it should also be written in the "Far-right politics in Russia" article.

These links show photos and videos of how Rogozin literally attends nazi rallies and does fascist salutes in his younger years. Couldn't be clearer. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mllhnkz (talk • contribs) 15:19, 15 June 2025 (UTC)

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/democracy-post/wp/2018/11/08/the-white-house-is-letting-a-russian-ultra-nationalist-into-the-u-s-despite-sanctions/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mllhnkz (talk • contribs) 22:25, 14 June 2025 (UTC)

https://www.dsnews.ua/ukr/world/kolishnih-nacistiv-ne-buvaye-rogozin-porivnyav-glavu-pentagonu-z-mavpoyu-25022024-496713

https://news.pn/uk/politics/153236

https://www.brd24.com/news/vid-rivnya-diskusiy-z-ilonom-maskom-do-eksperta-po-chopikam-na-berdyanskomu-vodokanali-nu-za-shcho-n.html

https://uc.od.ua/columns/1533/1227242

https://medium.com/@zloyodessit2.0/after-ruining-russias-defense-industry-and-roscosmos-dmitry-rogozin-should-return-to-his-roots-b18bb6b68f01

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FUItOUKQ-zc Mllhnkz (talk) 16:32, 14 June 2025 (UTC)

I should note that many of these sources were already discussed at the BLP noticeboard. Dsnews.ua does not write anything about this, there are only screenshots of social media posts and obviously we cannot use this. Regarding the Washington Post opinion piece, we have WP:RSEDITORIAL which says: Editorial commentary, analysis and opinion pieces, whether written by the editors of the publication (editorials) or outside authors (invited op-eds and letters to the editor from notable figures) are reliable primary sources for statements attributed to that editor or author, but are rarely reliable for statements of fact. To write in wikivoice that someone attended neo-Nazi rallies and did a fascist salute, we need much stronger sourcing. Mellk (talk) 12:05, 15 June 2025 (UTC)

I've added another reliable source for the salute (Politico Europe) and restored the content with some edits (the sign part is less supported, so I removed that) https://www.politico.eu/article/russia-notorious-ex-space-chief-dmitry-rogozin-roscosmos-wounded-donbas-ukraine-shelling/. WP:RSEDITORIAL also says "When taking information from opinion content, the identity of the author may help determine reliability. The opinions of specialists and recognized experts are more likely to be reliable and to reflect a significant viewpoint. If the statement is not authoritative, attribute the opinion to the author in the text of the article and do not represent it as fact." Vladimir Kara-Murza is certainly a recognized expert, so I am including this one. The Odessa Courier and Medium pieces are blogs, so I cut them. Dilova Stolytsya calls them "Photos from the rallies", so I will keep this, but feel free to remove. I think Prestupnosti is reliable, so I kept it. Not sure about BRD24, but also kept it for now. Also added Reuters and Sova Center for his participation in the rallies. LordDiscord (talk) 15:54, 15 June 2025 (UTC)

Where does Sova Center say he participated in neo-Nazi rallies? It only says: "DPNI sought a closer relationship with Dmitry Rogozin, resulting in :revival; of the Union of Russian Communities (KRO) on 9 December 2006." This is the only sentence where he is named.

Vladimir Kara-Murza is also an opposition politician. We should not used an opinion piece written by him to make statements in wikivoice about pro-Kremlin figures for obvious reasons (this is like using an opinion piece written by Navalny to write statements in wikivoice about Putin). The Politico article cites this Facebook post by the Ukrainian IT-Army. If this is the only reliable source that supports the statement about the salute, then it must be attributed.

Reuters calls him a nationalist politician and calls this a ultranationalist rally. Where does it say Rogozin himself gave a Nazi salute? It only says: "About 200 activists and skinheads in black leather jackets and heavy boots gave Nazi-style salutes as organisers yelled nationalist slogans from a makeshift stage at one of Moscow's central squares."

Considering that the sourcing is poor or does not directly support what is being stated, you must self-revert. Otherwise, another noticeboard discussion will be opened. Mellk (talk) 16:10, 15 June 2025 (UTC)

Sova Center: That is not the only place he is named. "The same is evidenced by the maneuvers around the Russian March. Firstly, the preparation for the event, which was perceived as a neo-Nazi march from the start (as seen from the publicized membership of the Organizing Committee, which included SS leader D. Dyomushkin) involved at least seven Duma members." which they say included "Five members of Rodina Party (D. Rogozin, A. Saveyev, V. Alksnis, I. Saveyeva, and B. Vinogradov) and two from LDPR (N. Kuryanovich and I. Musatov)."

Politico: Politico is a reliable source. It is not our job to do self-research on what primary sources they used or did not use. Nor does them linking to a video for readers to see it mean that this is their only source or that they did not do proper journalism, so this isn't even particularly convincing original research, even if it was on topic for Wikipedia.

Reuters: The source is not used for that, it is used for the claim that he participated in neo-Nazi rallies.

Considering that you didn't read the first source, are doing original research on the second, and didn't look to see what the third source was used for, I will not be self-reverting. But you are free to open a noticeboard discussion or make any changes you see fit. LordDiscord (talk) 16:30, 15 June 2025 (UTC)

You cited Sova Center for the statement that he attended neo-Nazi marches in the early 2000s. The source does not explicitly say Rogozin participated in neo-Nazi marches in the early 2000s. Either way, even if we pretend that it says that he participated in the march (in 2006!), it says it was perceived as a neo-Nazi march. How on earth can we write in wikivoice that this is a neo-Nazi march?

The Reuters article also does not call it a neo-Nazi march. It mentions the presence of 200 neo-Nazis. This is still a WP:BLP violation and I think you should have familiarized yourself with the policies more instead of trying to throw yourself into a discussion I participated in and undo my reversal of a BLP violation, just because I warned you about WP:GAMING before. Mellk (talk) 16:39, 15 June 2025 (UTC)

I would suggest reading the whole source. You immediately said he was mentioned only once, despite being mentioned multiple times, and now you are taking the sentence I used to show he participated as the only evidence that it was a neo-Nazi rally. If you read one sentence further: "Secondly, MP Sergei Baburin enabled the neo-Nazis to hold their 'march' legally by obtaining permission for his own party to hold a public meeting and allowing DPNI and skinheads, as well as Makashov and supporters of Colonel Kvachkov (charged with attempted assassination of Anatoly Chubais) to participate." Which is explicitly calling it the neo-Nazis' march.

Regardless, I will change it to "ultranationalist rally" until there is a consensus, since that is explicitly what Reuters explicitly calls it.

The line says "participated". LordDiscord (talk) 16:57, 15 June 2025 (UTC)

This is about the 2006 march. There were multiple Russian marches. Either way, calling the Russian march a neo-Nazi march is clearly POV. Navalny was also an organizer and he was not a neo-Nazi. Mellk (talk) 17:33, 15 June 2025 (UTC)