Talk:Colorado/Archive 2

Archive 1

Archive 2

Replacement of image

Maroon Bells, 14,163 ft., seen from Aspen Highlands

Image by User: Rhododendrites

User:Richardmouser recently added an image of Maroon Bells. I have inserted that image on the top-right, along with its caption. I am proposing it be replaced with the image on the bottom-right, a featured picture and quality image added by User: Rhododendrites. MOS:IMAGES states that editors should "find better images" and "use the best quality images available". My impression is that the bottom image is better quality, is of a larger file size, and does not have a distracting red rope in the image. The input of others would be appreciated. Magnolia677 (talk) 11:29, 9 February 2021 (UTC)

No question that the second image on this page is more suitable. -Roxy the grumpy dog . wooF 12:04, 9 February 2021 (UTC)

I agree the new photo is better than the one I put on the page. Just thought a photo of the Maroon Bells would be good for the Colorado page. Thank you for finding a more suitable photo Magnolia677. - Richardmouser

Moving the History section

I'm going to move the History section further up the page, keeping it in line with other state articles. ~ Pbritti (talk) 22:37, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

This article needs a better map--missing towns of significant size

The map of the state of Colorado featured in this article is flawed. It omits sizeable towns such as Vail, Estes Parks and Carbondale with populations of five or six thousand, Golden with almost 20,000, and even Loveland with a population of almost 80,000, while featuring towns of a few hundred people such as Walden and Hot Sulphur Springs. Pciszek (talk) 09:18, 3 May 2021 (UTC)

Adding a tag to bring it to the attention of editors who work on such things. N2e (talk) 11:50, 3 May 2021 (UTC)

Name of the state

The origin of Colorado's name is something of debate. As Seraphimblade points out in his edits, the name for the state is generally attributed to the Colorado River (despite the Colorado River not originating in the state and indeed not having any portion of itself in the state until a politician lobbied to relabel a tributary). However, we can't say that the state is "definitively" named after the river, as we have multiple sources that claim otherwise and no source appears to cite any official resource. If anyone has a recommendation for how to phrase this section of the lede, please discuss below. Until then, I'll insert an interim sentence addressing the name. ~ Pbritti (talk) 18:41, 21 April 2021 (UTC)

Actually, it looks like neither is particularly verifiable. The "source" cited for the rocks claim is rather junk (), and the source they cite as their source, , has absolutely nothing on it about being from rocks. That aside, the source in the body text which supposedly was used for the river claim didn't confirm that either. So for now, the only verifiable part is that it's from the Spanish for "colored red", and until better references can be found that verifies any more than that, we can't support anything further than that either way. Seraphimblade ^{Talk to me} 19:31, 21 April 2021 (UTC)

Hey @Seraphimblade: While I think you might be dismissing the sources a little too liberally, I agree that the situation is not preferable. I reached out to History Colorado for their take on the matter. I uncovered this source from Encyclopedia Brittanica Kids, which is authoritative enough with regards to reflecting formal research, though they provide no evidence and appear to be simply tying Colorado the state and Colorado the river together solely on the basis of name. I won't add the source myself in order to preserve the stability of the page, though you may do so. ~ Pbritti (talk) 19:47, 21 April 2021 (UTC)

Thanks for that. I'll also ask the Denver Public Library, they have a pretty extensive Western History collection and will likely know where to find more information on it. Seraphimblade ^{Talk to me} 20:03, 21 April 2021 (UTC)

@Seraphimblade: Hey! I forgot to get back to you on this. History Colorado answered my email and I’ll transcribe what Sam Bock of their team said here:

I'm not sure that History Colorado has any documentation for this account, but I've always understood that the founders of Colorado Springs (previously called Colorado City) sent two lobbyists to Washington DC in the years leading up to statehood to propose the name "Colorado" for the territory as they thought it would boost tourism and migration to their town. The Colorado in "Colorado City" appears to have come from the spanish for the red rocks around CO Springs.

Fascinating stuff if you ask me. Thanks for your patience! ~ Pbritti (talk) 05:32, 13 June 2021 (UTC)

General errors

Colorado in spanish means Colorful, not Red which would be Rojo or maybe as well Pinto in an archsic form of red. There is a mistake on the etymology of the word. The spanish called the river colorado due to its red color "the colorful river" not the "Red River". This is an important mistake.

There's something glitchy going on with the quotation marks on the anthem line of the infobox — Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.106.237.97 (talk) 22:32, 10 September 2019 (UTC)

The above paragraph about the Spanish word colorado is completely wrong. Colorado means "color of red" in Spanish. Pinto means "painted" in Spanish, and usually refers to something that has multiple colors (like a pinto horse or a pinto bean). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.38.162.196 (talk) 15:59, 19 May 2021 (UTC)

Ruddy is really a better English translation of the Spanish adjective Colorado. Yours aye,  Buaidh  talk e-mail 05:07, 23 March 2022 (UTC)

Colorado Rivers, Lakes, Streams, Creeks (Waterways in General !?!?!?!?) from archives

Colorado waters have been protected by Colorado State Constitution. Gov sources should supply much info. Also as recent as a few years Water rights have changed. Geology, Streams, drainages, probably enough to create a separate article. I might have a look into this. Or would someone care to discuss?Paptilian (talk) 15:52, 6 December 2020 (UTC)

Did you ever look into this and change it?Danbeam42 (talk) 21:10, 28 January 2022 (UTC)

Width Wrong?

The statistics table at the top of the article lists the width of the state at 280mi. The state is nearly square, so the length given for the state (380mi.) is also roughly correct for the width. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.38.162.196 (talk) 16:11, 19 May 2021 (UTC)

No, it's correct. You can go on Google Maps and measure the distance to verify it. I just did that and the statistics in the info box are correct. DonaldDuck176 (talk) 20:25, 29 October 2022 (UTC)

Fauna image

@Magnolia677: Hey! Just wanted to take to the Talk Page to discuss the reversion of the wolf image. I’m of the persuasion that it emphasizes the adversarial relationship man had with wolves and predators in general in Colorado during a particular period of the state’s history. You deleted it on the basis that it’s an aesthetic matter. If there are guidelines on such things, I’d really appreciate being pointed to the relevant page because I assume there are established norms for these sorts of pages but I don’t know them. In any case, I would encourage you not to perceive the wolf image as an aesthetic choice but rather something worthy of inclusion due to its illustrative qualities. Thanks! ~ Pbritti (talk) 05:28, 13 June 2021 (UTC)

@Pbritti: The policy is MOS:IMAGERELEVANCE, but I restored the image to the article. My concern was the 30+ year gap between the extirpation--mentioned in the article--and the date of the photo. Magnolia677 (talk) 09:53, 13 June 2021 (UTC)

@Magnolia677: Ah, I can see where that relevancy issue could come from. That’s said, I do wish state pages had their own standards as they are consistently popular pages. Thanks for your editing on this page! ~ Pbritti (talk) 14:31, 13 June 2021 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:

• 2006 CO Proof.png

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 20:40, 3 July 2021 (UTC)

Shouldn't abortion be mentioned?

Is any of this actually WP: Undue?

While abortion law may not merit mention pre-Dobbs, it seems obvious to me that abortion law now merits mention in state's articles. KlayCax (talk) 23:15, 6 April 2023 (UTC)

@KlayCax: Colorado's abortion law history has already long been in the article. It is not a crucial aspect of the state. ~ Pbritti (talk) 23:20, 6 April 2023 (UTC)

Thanks for responding, @Pbritti:. I'm aware that there was a general agreement to generally not include mention of abortion (particularly in leads) pre-Dobbs. However, that agreement was reached in circumstances far different than today. I want to note that I don't think abortion should be mentioned in every article. But Colorado legalizing abortion at every stage of pregnancy is notable (and not typical of the U.S.) — and has been been frequently mentioned in profiles of the state.

I would only mention abortion in around 10-15% of present state articles. (Those with near-total bans and legal at every stage of pregnancy) That doesn't seem undue to me. KlayCax (talk) 23:26, 6 April 2023 (UTC)

You're unilaterally changing consensus without consulting subject-matter experts on multiple state articles. Colorado is notable for a wide variety of reasons that don't bear mention in the lead. Many of these articles such as Colorado's, already mentioned their exceptional legal practices regarding abortion (going both ways) but you've added whole independent sections on the subject. You acted boldly, but these edits need to stop until you have a consensus to support this change in standard. ~ Pbritti (talk) 23:45, 6 April 2023 (UTC)

What do you think of this?

• State's laws on abortion are mentioned in every article's body.
• Abortion law is only mentioned in the lead of a state's article if:
  • 1.) It is legal at all stages of pregnancy (Colorado, Alaska, New Mexico, New Jeresy, Vermont)
  • 2.) There are near-total bans with no exceptions for rape, incest, et al. (Wisconsin, South Dakota, several other states in Deep South.)
  • 3.) Precendent setting (Idaho's "abortion trafficking" bill, Texas's Heartbeat Act, et al.)

I think guidelines similar to this would be an improvement on the status quo. Mentions of abortion would still be limited to a small minority of states; with Dobbs overturned, it seems to me WP: Due. KlayCax (talk) 00:07, 7 April 2023 (UTC)

You probably need to get consensus from each individual state's regular editors or from a community like WikiProject United States. Of these, perhaps only Texas bears mention in an encyclopedic lead. For what it's worth, these sorts of things are also covered far better and with the gravity they are due in other articles not exclusively on abortion (for example, List of Colorado ballot measures). These broad-stroke edits to relatively stable pages need far more nuance than has been exhibited. ~ Pbritti (talk) 00:12, 7 April 2023 (UTC)

• Would you personally be okay with it being mentioned in Colorado's article's lead?
• Would a RFC be appropriate here? If so, I'm not sure where to exactly have it. This article? I'm not typically involved with Wikiprojects. I'll definitely ask, though. Thanks. KlayCax (talk) 00:17, 7 April 2023 (UTC)

Yeah, an RFC is probably a good idea (on all of these). I highly doubt you're the only one who feels the way you do (I feel pretty strongly that, save for Texas, these mentions are undue). I think a single RFC at WikiProject US with notices on the relevant state articles and perhaps invitations to other WikiProjects is the way to go (I can help ensure cast a suitably wide and even net). ~ Pbritti (talk) 00:25, 7 April 2023 (UTC)

Creating one now, @Pbritti:. KlayCax (talk) 00:52, 7 April 2023 (UTC)

Colorado River and the state's name

The state of Colorado is not named for the Colorado River. While this seems like a simple enough explanation of the state's name–similar region, same meaning, same people doing the naming, etc.–the origins of the state's name are not usually described in modern reliable sources beyond that it is the Spanish word for "red" and "ruddy" (see Britannica and Colorado Encyclopedia). Two years ago, I asked History Colorado this question in order to put the matter to bed. Most of the 26 August 2021 response from Sam Bock, then a public historian and exhibit developer at History Colorado, is provided below (I've removed the polite greeting and send off from the email):

From what I understand, you are correct that the state's name did not come from the river, which was known as the Grand River until after Colorado was named.

I'm not sure that History Colorado has any documentation for this account, but I've always understood that the founders of Colorado Springs (previously called Colorado City) sent two lobbyists to Washington DC in the years leading up to statehood to propose the name "Colorado" for the territory as they thought it would boost tourism and migration to their town. The Colorado in "Colorado City" appears to have come from the spanish for the red rocks around CO Springs.

Dorothy Aldridge has a book on Colorado City that may have more information.

I hope we can put this persistent (and oft-repeated) misconception to bed. ~ Pbritti (talk) 22:31, 1 May 2023 (UTC)

Thanks to IP 97.118.64.152 who corrected the incorrect material added during these revisions. Please discuss on talk and provide sourcing that substantiates claims. ~ Pbritti (talk) 21:28, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

Article issues

This article is assessed as B-class. Part of the criteria is: The article is suitably referenced, with inline citations. It has reliable sources, and any important or controversial material which is likely to be challenged is cited. There are several unsourced sub-sections that surely should be referenced since they go beyond "the sky is blue". Otr500 (talk) 23:32, 27 August 2022 (UTC)

Not anymore. Wow (talk) 01:23, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

Long-term Abuse

This article is a long-term target for newly created sockpuppets/vandalism-only acounts. This began on 8/21 when someone added "sigma". Over the next 2 months, new accounts and IPs add slangs like "sigma" and "yass queen". If this continues, this article will need to be semi-protected indefinitely and we may need to start a sockpuppet investigation 2603:8080:D03:89D4:76E7:6E76:D599:24BE (talk) 03:25, 18 October 2024 (UTC)