Talk:Clara Senecal

External links section for this article

@Nikkimaria: I noticed you removed the section I added for an external link to "Clara Cagle (1865-1944)," at the WikiTree website. ( https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Cagle-2230 ) . Your comments when removing this section suggest you think that this external links to be reliable sources. The standard for external links is different to that for citation. For example user generated website like Find-a-Grave can appear in the External links section. I think this particular person profile on the WikiTree website is more reliable than the person's Find-A-Grave memorial, so why do you think it is not a suitable external link? - Cameron Dewe (talk) 07:05, 12 April 2026 (UTC)

My comment was in response to yours that "It is also probably a better source than her Find-A-Grave memorial, which it also cites" - it's not clear to me why it would be considered a better source than one that it cites. But there are a couple of additional problems that suggest this link shouldn't be included. First, it's not clear that it has the right to copy the materials that it does - this is a potential linkvio problem. Second, it seems to meet multiple WP:ELNO criteria. Nikkimaria (talk) 00:04, 13 April 2026 (UTC)

• Nikkimaria, I see you removed the external link to find-a-grave I added, i don't see anything objectionable on that page? I know not everyone loves that site but its frequently an EL on dead American biographies. Relatedly i can't believe i actually sourced the marriage date to a reliable source, Fultonhistory.com is a rickety web 1.0 delight, and the ny historic newspaper site seems to have incorped many of their sources.--Milowent • ^hasspoken 12:40, 16 April 2026 (UTC)

What do you see as the benefit of that link? Nikkimaria (talk) 23:47, 16 April 2026 (UTC)

@Nikkimaria: Senecal's memorial on the Find-A-Grave website provides the dates for her birth and death. While it is user generated sources of information, it does include images of her gravestone. There doesn't appear to be any other online sources for this information, unless one trawls through microfiche images of New York State birth, marriage and death records. Searching for New York State cemetery record also results in local authorities directing people to consult Find-A-Grave, because other local records are not online. It may not be a very reliable source but it is better than no source at all. - Cameron Dewe (talk) 07:01, 17 April 2026 (UTC)

The gravestone image doesn't support the dates given, though, so where are those dates coming from? Nikkimaria (talk) 00:39, 18 April 2026 (UTC)

I think that is a question you need to ask of the Find-A-Grave contributors. The memorial appears relatively new and does not look like it was erected in 1944. Perhaps the dates were copied from an older memorial and transcribed incorrectly. That said, the memorial does indicate where she was interred. - Cameron Dewe (talk) 00:53, 18 April 2026 (UTC)

The memorial itself does not, but we already have a source for that claim anyways. Nikkimaria (talk) 00:56, 18 April 2026 (UTC)

• Nikkimaria, lol, well well. after writing hundreds of biographies, one would think i know this, but i wasn't aware of the fairly negative view taken of Find A Grave in places like Wikipedia:Reliable_sources/Perennial_sources#Find_a_Grave, despite the template apparently being kept handily three times in deletion discussions. Controversy!! i tend to add it as an EL when it has a picture of the gravestone, accurate family member info, and perhaps news clippings, like this one does. But I don't feel compelled to insist on its usage. Fun fact, I wrote the article because I was perusing the New York Post for one hundred years ago to the day on April 10.--Milowent • ^hasspoken 18:57, 17 April 2026 (UTC)