Talk:Chermin Island

GA review

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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This review is transcluded from Talk:Chermin Island/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Nominator: Pangalau (talk · contribs) 14:09, 16 June 2025 (UTC)

Reviewer: Spookyaki (talk · contribs) 17:32, 20 July 2025 (UTC)

I'll go ahead and review this! Spookyaki (talk) 17:32, 20 July 2025 (UTC)

GA review (see here for what the criteria are, and here for what they are not)

1. It is reasonably well written.

   a (prose, spelling, and grammar): b (MoS for lead, layout, word choice, fiction, and lists):

2. It is factually accurate and verifiable, as shown by a source spot-check.

   a (reference section): b (inline citations to reliable sources): c (OR): d (copyvio and plagiarism):

3. It is broad in its coverage.

   a (major aspects): b (focused):

4. It follows the neutral point of view policy.

   Fair representation without bias:

5. It is stable.

   No edit wars, etc.:

6. It is illustrated by images and other media, where possible and appropriate.

   a (images are tagged and non-free content have non-free use rationales): b (appropriate use with suitable captions):

7. Overall:

   Pass/Fail:

Image looks good (nice pic!). False positive copyvio from Mapcarta, but seems like it's drawing on Wikipedia for its info. Otherwise no issues there. Going to do some minor ce myself, but here are my notes, required revisions in red and suggestions not required for GA in purple. Spookyaki (talk) 17:32, 20 July 2025 (UTC)

Lead

Chermin Island served as a key defensive point during this period of political and military instability.—Or something like this. Mostly I think that "Chermin Island's significance was further underscored" is MOS:OP-ED Spookyaki (talk) 17:32, 20 July 2025 (UTC)

Sentence has been rephrased. Pangalau (talk) 01:30, 21 July 2025 (UTC)

You will certainly know better than me, but is there a reason that "Brunei Town" is used rather than Bandar Seri Begawan and why it isn't linked? Spookyaki (talk) 17:32, 20 July 2025 (UTC)

I have further clarified in the sentence that Brunei Town is the former name of the current capital, Bandar Seri Begawan. In addition, it is now linked. Pangalau (talk) 01:29, 21 July 2025 (UTC)

Geography

Its northern extremity is marked by a prominent rock, with Chermin Rock, less than a fathom deep, situated nearby.—These are different rocks? If so, maybe clarify. Spookyaki (talk) 17:32, 20 July 2025 (UTC)

Further clarification. Pangalau (talk) 14:04, 21 July 2025 (UTC)

The island's vegetation includes nipa trees on the eastern side: part of a mangrove area with species such as Avicennia, Rhizophora, and Sonneratia.—Or something like this. Right now, it's not clear to me whether the nipa trees are a separate grove or a part of this mangrove area. Based on the source, it seems like it's the latter. Spookyaki (talk) 17:32, 20 July 2025 (UTC)

Sentence has been rewritten for better clarification. Pangalau (talk) 01:32, 21 July 2025 (UTC)

The rest of the island features primary forest growth, with limited sandy beaches and mostly muddy shores.—Link old-growth forest for "primary forest" (highlighted)? Spookyaki (talk) 17:32, 20 July 2025 (UTC)

Further clarification. Pangalau (talk) 14:04, 21 July 2025 (UTC)

Significant erosion is evident on the western side of the island. Although currently abandoned, Chermin Island is occasionally used as a leisure spot by serious sports fishermen.—Per MOS:OP-ED Spookyaki (talk) 17:32, 20 July 2025 (UTC)

Word removed. Pangalau (talk) 14:04, 21 July 2025 (UTC)

Spot check

Chermin Island, located at the mouth of the Brunei River, spans 5 hectares (12 acres)...  Verified Spookyaki (talk) 17:32, 20 July 2025 (UTC)

The island's vegetation includes nipa trees on the eastern side, linked to a mangrove area with species such as Avicennia, Rhizophora, and Sonneratia. Basically  Verified, but see above Spookyaki (talk) 17:32, 20 July 2025 (UTC)

Further clarification. Pangalau (talk) 14:16, 21 July 2025 (UTC)

History

Ong Sum Ping moved to Brunei with his people and created Kota Batu, the sultans' palace, and built a stone bar at Chermin Island, strengthening the area's defensive qualities.—Again, you'd know better than me, but the Wikipedia page for Ong Sum Ping claims he is a "legendary figure". Should this claim be qualified in lights of this? Spookyaki (talk) 17:32, 20 July 2025 (UTC)

I have not verified the claims in the article about Ong Sum Ping, so I refrained from describing him as a "legendary figure." Pangalau (talk) 01:36, 21 July 2025 (UTC)

I found at least one source that claims that "the appearance of Ong Sum Ping in the genealogy of the Brunei sultans most likely reflects oral local lore concerning the presence of Chinese who not necessarily would have made it to Boni in the late fourteenth or early fifteenth century" and that "the characters of Ong Sum Ping and Ong Kong/Wang Kong in the royal genealogies are fictional, so the search for Ong Sum Ping is futile". Given this, I think claims about Ong Sum Ping should be qualified in some way, even if it's just to say "allegedly." Adding an explanatory footnote might also be helpful. Spookyaki (talk) 02:23, 21 July 2025 (UTC)

Explanatory note given. Pangalau (talk) 14:11, 21 July 2025 (UTC)

Using cannons created during Sultan Shah Brunei's and his own rule, this was firmly enforced.—"This" being the bridge? The fortifications? Please clarify. Spookyaki (talk) 17:32, 20 July 2025 (UTC)

Sentence clarified. Pangalau (talk) 14:05, 21 July 2025 (UTC)

Maybe link bendahara? Spookyaki (talk) 17:32, 20 July 2025 (UTC)

Pengiran Bendahara has been linked to Vizier (Brunei). Pangalau (talk) 01:39, 21 July 2025 (UTC)

Mubin relocated to the island under the guidance of the newly appointed Pengiran Bongsu (later Muhyiddin), hoping to wait out the brewing crisis.—Or something similar. Sentence is very difficult to understand as-is. Spookyaki (talk) 17:32, 20 July 2025 (UTC)

Sentence has been rephrased. Pangalau (talk) 01:39, 21 July 2025 (UTC)

After relocating Spookyaki (talk) 17:32, 20 July 2025 (UTC)

Done. Pangalau (talk) 01:40, 21 July 2025 (UTC)

Muhyiddin's forces landed on the island. No fighting took place, as most of the islands fortifications were destroyed by a bombardment executed earlier by Tanjong Kindana.—Or something similar. This sentence is also very difficult to understand. Spookyaki (talk) 17:32, 20 July 2025 (UTC)

Sentence rewritten for clarification. Pangalau (talk) 01:42, 21 July 2025 (UTC)

Mubin sent most of the regalia into the Brunei Bay with cannons.—Don't have access to this source, but what does this mean? Do we know why he did this? Spookyaki (talk) 17:32, 20 July 2025 (UTC)

Doesn't seem to have any additional information explaining why. Pangalau (talk) 01:58, 21 July 2025 (UTC)

Okay, that's fair. What does "with cannons" mean in this sentence, though? The regalia was sunk in Brunei Bay alongside some cannons, which were also sunk? The regalia was shot into Brunei Bay using cannons? Please clarify. Spookyaki (talk) 02:26, 21 July 2025 (UTC)

Clarified statement. Pangalau (talk) 14:14, 21 July 2025 (UTC)

It is claimed that he was buried on the island.—Do we know by who? Spookyaki (talk) 17:32, 20 July 2025 (UTC)

This was only mentioned in a report published by the Her Majesty's Stationery Office Pangalau (talk) 01:59, 21 July 2025 (UTC)

Sultan Muhammad Alam was allegedly assassinated by a hired killer on Chermin Island in 1828, marking the end of another civil war. Spookyaki (talk) 17:32, 20 July 2025 (UTC)

Sentence rephrased. Pangalau (talk) 02:00, 21 July 2025 (UTC)

Spot check

Ong Sum Ping moved to Brunei with his people and created Kota Batu, the sultans' palace, and built a stone bar at Chermin Island, strengthening the area's defensive qualities. Basically  Verified, but see above Spookyaki (talk) 17:32, 20 July 2025 (UTC)

Statement clarified. Pangalau (talk) 14:16, 21 July 2025 (UTC)

Mubin then relocated the administrative capital from Kota Batu to the island during his reign...—Basically  Verified, though you should maybe specify the page number if one is available. For me, this is on page 144. Spookyaki (talk) 17:32, 20 July 2025 (UTC)

Done. Pangalau (talk) 14:15, 21 July 2025 (UTC)

After breaking a treaty, Mubin ultimately made his way back to Chermin Island.—I don't think this is what the source is saying. It seems like Mubin ultimately made his way back to Chermin Island, after which several treaties were made and broken during the civil war. Honestly, given that the previous sentence already established that he fought the war from the island, I don't know that this sentence is necessary at all. Spookyaki (talk) 17:32, 20 July 2025 (UTC)

Sentence removed. Pangalau (talk) 01:57, 21 July 2025 (UTC)

Sultan Muhammad Alam's death in 1828, marking the end of another civil war, is closely linked to Chermin Island, where he was allegedly assassinated by hired killers. However, historian Jamil Al-Sufri questions this account due to a lack of evidence. An alternative version suggests he voluntarily left Brunei and moved to Putatan in Sabah, where a gravestone is believed to mark his burial. While there is no proof he was buried on Chermin Island, the gravestone closely resembles other royal tombstones in Brunei.  Verified Spookyaki (talk) 17:32, 20 July 2025 (UTC)

Legacy

Since there's only one entry, I don't think this needs to be formatted as a bulleted list. Spookyaki (talk) 17:32, 20 July 2025 (UTC)

Done. Pangalau (talk) 01:58, 21 July 2025 (UTC)

Spot check

The island has been depicted on the reverse side of the B$100 note since 2004.  Verified Spookyaki (talk) 17:32, 20 July 2025 (UTC)

Reference section

Sources need to be sorted. My preference would be alphabetically, but other logical sorting schemes are also acceptable per MOS:REFERENCES. Spookyaki (talk) 17:32, 20 July 2025 (UTC)

References have been sorted out. Pangalau (talk) 02:35, 21 July 2025 (UTC)

Overall, great work! Hope we can get it to GA together. Spookyaki (talk) 17:32, 20 July 2025 (UTC)

@Pangalau: Alright, after another readthrough, almost everything looks good. There's just one remaining question I have. At one point, the article says that the civil war between Muhyiddin and Mubin was "the only civil war in the country", but another civil war is mentioned several paragraphs down. I guess... Which is it? Spookyaki (talk) 14:44, 21 July 2025 (UTC)

There have been several minor "civil wars" throughout Brunei's history, the most notable and significant being the conflict between Muhyiddin and Mubin. For this reason, I have revised the sentence to say "thus sparking a civil war in the country." Pangalau (talk) 15:33, 21 July 2025 (UTC)

Okay! With that, I think everything looks good. I'm ready to pass this now. Thanks for your hard work on the article! Spookyaki (talk) 15:34, 21 July 2025 (UTC)

References

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Did you know nomination

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Dclemens1971 talk 18:12, 8 September 2025 (UTC)

(

• Comment or view
• Article history

)

Chermin Island in 2022

• ... that Chermin Island (pictured) once served as a fortified stronghold in Brunei's defence and later became the palace of Sultan Abdul Hakkul Mubin during the Brunei civil war?

• Sources: Vienne, Marie-Sybille de (2015). Brunei: From the Age of Commerce to the 21st Century. Translated by Emilia Lanier. Singapore: NUS Press. ISBN 978-9971-69-818-8. and Ooi, Keat Gin; King, Victor T. (2023). Routledge Handbook of Contemporary Brunei. Abingdon: Routledge. doi:10.4324/9781003020431. ISBN 978-1-000-56864-6.

• • ALT1 ... that Chermin Island (pictured), at the Brunei River's mouth, became Abdul Hakkul Mubin's palace and administrative seat during the Brunei civil war?

• Sources: Same as above.

• • ALT2 ... that Chermin Island (pictured), at the Brunei River's mouth, became Abdul Hakkul Mubin's administrative seat during the Brunei civil war?

• Sources: Same as above.

• • Reviewed:

Improved to Good Article status by Pangalau (talk). Number of QPQs required: 0. Nominator has fewer than 5 past nominations.

Pangalau (talk) 07:32, 29 July 2025 (UTC).

• @Pangalau: Did the island become the sultan's palace or did it house his palace? I also don't seen an explicit mention of this hook in the article, i.e. that the island was (or housed) a palace during the war. Yue🌙 02:05, 9 August 2025 (UTC)
  • @Yue: Although not explicitly stated, it is likely that the island served as his palace, as it was noted to be fortified. Pangalau (talk) 02:43, 9 August 2025 (UTC)
    • @Pangalau: The hook should be explicitly mentioned / paraphrased in the article with the same citation, per WP:DYKHOOKCITE. Right now part of this hook is only implied in the article, but the reader has to make that specific connection themselves while reading the article without anything in the prose suggesting a notable connection. Yue🌙 17:24, 15 August 2025 (UTC)
      • @Yue: The hook has been paraphrased and appears in ALT1.
• I was originally only going to comment, but I will do the full review since it's been quite some time since the nomination was started. Yue🌙 01:51, 28 August 2025 (UTC)

General: Article is new enough and long enough
New enough: Long enough:

Policy: Article is sourced, neutral, and free of copyright problems
Adequate sourcing: Neutral: Free of copyright violations, plagiarism, and close paraphrasing:

Hook: Hook has been verified by provided inline citation
Cited: Interesting:

QPQ: None required.

Overall: Citations 5–6, 15, and 27–29 spot-checked for verification; no issues arose. The nominator forgot to add to this nomination the source that backs up one part of each hook (that the island was the palace), so I added it for them. I removed the Wikilink to the Sultan of Brunei because there should not be overlapping Wikilinks per MOS:SOB. Yue🌙 01:51, 28 August 2025 (UTC)

Yue, Pangalau, it seems reasonable to state this was the administrative seat, but the article says "A palace and several houses were proposed on the island", rather than the island being the palace. I think the hook is still interesting with the minor clarifying tweak, but I wanted to check I'm not missing something (not being able to see page numbers on Ooi & King 2023). CMD (talk) 11:03, 6 September 2025 (UTC)

@Chipmunkdavis:I have suggested an alternative hook that places greater emphasis on the ‘administrative seat’ instead. Pangalau (talk) 01:15, 7 September 2025 (UTC)

Thanks, that works well. CMD (talk) 02:19, 7 September 2025 (UTC)