Talk:Buttigieg

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On 16 April 2024, it was proposed that this article be moved to Buttigieg (surname). The result of the discussion was no consensus.

To add to article

Latest comment: 7 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

To add to article: does this surname literally mean something like "lord of the poultry"? 173.88.241.33 (talk) 01:42, 21 March 2019 (UTC)Reply

Requested move 16 April 2024

Latest comment: 2 years ago9 comments8 people in discussion

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: no consensus. (non-admin closure) Safari Scribe^{Edits! Talk!} 06:22, 21 May 2024 (UTC)Reply

Buttigieg → Buttigieg (surname) – Per WP:PRIMARYTOPIC, the 4 criteria of WP:DETERMINEPRIMARY, WP:CONSISTENT, and WP:NAMEPAGE#Narrow qualifiers, I argue that the current title of this page should be a WP:PRIMARYREDIRECT to Pete Buttigieg (the incumbent United States Secretary of Transportation). For editors who are concerned that this RM is an example of Americentrism, please read the extended rationale on the corresponding talk page. AndrewPeterT (talk) (contribs) 06:29, 16 April 2024 (UTC) — Relisting. ASUKITE 14:39, 24 April 2024 (UTC) — Relisting. BilledMammal (talk) 02:45, 13 May 2024 (UTC)Reply

Extended rationale

NOTE: In the interest of full disclosure, I was the editor who worked to promote Pete Buttigieg's article to Good Article status in 2021.

I also would like to note that aside from Secretary Pete, no other person whose surname is Buttigieg has a Wikipedia article that has Good Article status or a higher quality, as evidenced by the article traffic statistics links below in 2.).

WP:PRIMARYTOPIC and WP:DETERMINEPRIMARY

1.) WikiNav results - When analyzing traffic to and from this page, it can be seen that 73.68% of the outgoing page views in February 2024 and 60.14% of the outgoing views in March 2024 were to Secretary Pete Buttigieg's article.

2.) Wikipedia article traffic statistics - A, B, and C: From the linked Wikimedia Cloud Service data analyses, it can be seen that Secretary Buttigieg's article receives at least 474% more daily average views than everyone else pertinent who shares his surname as of March 1, 2021. The hatted table provides more specific calculations:

Sortable table of daily average page views of everyone listed at Buttigieg over past 3 years

Daily page views of Pete Buttigieg versus other people whose surname is Buttigieg since March 1, 2021^[a]
Article title	Average daily page views
Albert Buttigieg	0
Anthony Buttigieg	3
Anton Buttigieg	17
Chasten Buttigieg^[b]	605
Claudette Buttigieg^[c]	7^[c]
Claudette Pace^[c]	7^[c]
John Buttigieg (footballer)	6
John Buttigieg (rugby league)	5
Joseph Buttigieg^[d]	165
Mark Buttigieg	10
Michael Franciscus Buttigieg	1
Norman Buttigieg	1
Pete Buttigieg	3,474
Ray Buttigieg	2
Rebecca Buttigieg	3
Robbie Buttigieg	1
Simone Buttigieg^[e]	1^[e]

Notes

↑ In the two years prior to March 2021, Secretary Buttigieg was often in the headlines of American media for multiple reasons. These included running for President of the United States, campaigning in 2020 on behalf of Joe Biden, and becoming the first LGBT+ individual to become a White House cabinet secretary. Consequently, comparing page views before March 2021 is problematic because of the influence of WP:RECENTISM and WP:BIAS on the data.
↑ The article's subject is the husband of Secretary Buttigieg.
1 2 3 4 Claudette Buttigieg is a redirect to Claudette Pace. The page views provided are the sum of the views to the redirect article and target article.
↑ The article's subject is the father of Secretary Buttigieg.
1 2 Simone Buttigieg is a redirect to List of Malta women's international footballers. The page views provided are for the redirect article only.

3.) Usage in (English-language) reliable sources - 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, and 16: From the linked Google Scholar search results, it can be seen that Secretary Buttigieg receives at least 181% more mentions in scholarly literature than everyone else pertinent who shares his surname. The hatted table provides more specific calculations:

Sortable table of Google Scholar results of everyone listed at Buttigieg

Google Scholar results of Pete Buttigieg versus other people whose surname is Buttigieg^[a]
Article title	Number of results
Albert Buttigieg	12
Anthony Buttigieg^[b]	22^[b]
Anton Buttigieg	304
Chasten Buttigieg^[c]	41
Claudette Buttigieg^[d]	22^[d]
Claudette Pace^[d]	22^[d]
John Buttigieg (footballer)^[e]	48^[e]
John Buttigieg (rugby league)^[e]	48^[e]
Joseph Buttigieg^[f]^[g]	904^[g]
Mark Buttigieg	28
Michael Franciscus Buttigieg	0
Norman Buttigieg	0
Pete Buttigieg	2,540
Ray Buttigieg	9
Rebecca Buttigieg	7
Robbie Buttigieg	1
Simone Buttigieg^[h]	3^[h]

Notes

↑ No date restrictions were used when compiling these search results.
1 2 Anthony is the middle name of Joseph Buttigieg. To eliminate search results for Joseph Buttigieg, the search command "anthony buttigieg" - joseph was used.
↑ The article's subject is the husband of Secretary Buttigieg.
1 2 3 4 Claudette Buttigieg is a redirect to Claudette Pace. The results provided are the sum of the results of the individual search commands "claudette buttigieg" and "claudette pace".
1 2 3 4 The search command "john buttigieg" was used to find results for this individual and does not account for Wikipedia's disambiguation. Consequently, some of the relevant scholarly mentions may be for other people.
↑ The article's subject is the father of Secretary Buttigieg.
1 2 To eliminate search results for Anthony Buttigieg, the search command "joseph buttigieg" - anthony was used.
1 2 Simone Buttigieg is a redirect to List of Malta women's international footballers. The search results were obtained using the search command "simone buttigieg" and do not account for the latter title.

4.) Incoming Wikipedia page wikilinks - I, II, III, IV, V, VI, VII, VIII, IX, X, XI, XII, XIII, XIV, XV, XVI, XVII, XVIII, and XIX: From the linked Special:WhatLinksHere search results, it can be seen that Secretary Buttigieg's article has at least 737% more incoming links than each of those for everyone else pertinent who shares his surname. The hatted table provides more specific calculations:

Sortable table of incoming page links of all articles listed at Buttigieg

Incoming wikilinks for Pete Buttigieg versus other people whose surname is Buttigieg
Article title	Number of pages that link to article
Albert Buttigieg	7
Anthony Buttigieg	11
Anton Buttigieg	65
Chasten Buttigieg^[a]	85
Claudette Buttigieg^[b]	160^[b]
Claudette Pace^[b]	160^[b]
John Buttigieg (footballer)	87
John Buttigieg (rugby league)	36
Joseph Buttigieg^[c]	47
Mark Buttigieg	77
Michael Franciscus Buttigieg	8
Norman Buttigieg	49
Pete Buttigieg^[d]	1,339^[d]
Ray Buttigieg	29
Rebecca Buttigieg	11
Robbie Buttigieg	11
Simone Buttigieg^[e]	18^[e]

Notes

↑ The article's subject is the husband of Secretary Buttigieg.
1 2 3 4 Claudette Buttigieg is a redirect to Claudette Pace. The count provided is the sum of the incoming page links to the redirect article and target article.
↑ The article's subject is the father of Secretary Buttigieg.
1 2 The count provided for Pete Buttigieg was calculated in intervals of 500 page links.
1 2 Simone Buttigieg is a redirect to List of Malta women's international footballers. The count provided is for the redirect article only.

WP:CONSISTENT and WP:NAMEPAGE#Narrow qualifiers

When analyzing the titles of the 10 most common surnames in the United States on Wikipedia (according to the 2010 United States census: link), we see that the format TARGET TITLE (surname) is used on all but one occasion. As the hatted table specifically demonstrates, this RM's proposed target will also make this page's title more consistent with the guidance of WP:NAMEPAGE#Narrow qualifiers:

Sortable table of article titles of most common American surnames

Most common last names in the United States in 2010
Article title	Rank	Adherence to WP:NAMEPAGE#Narrow qualifiers
Smith (surname)	1	Yes
Johnson	2	No
Williams (surname)	3	Yes
Brown (surname)	4	Yes
Jones (surname)	5	Yes
García (surname)^[a]	6	Yes
Miller (surname)	7	Yes
Davis (surname)	8	Yes
Rodríguez (surname)^[a]	9	Yes
Martínez (surname)^[a]	10	Yes

Notes

1 2 3 The source for this table's rankings does not use the acute accent for this surname.

AndrewPeterT (talk) (contribs) 06:29, 16 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

Survey

Oppose. No primary redirect here by long-term significance. Just WP:RECENTISM. -- Necrothesp (talk) 10:17, 16 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
Support per nom. ~~ Jessintime (talk) 15:12, 16 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
Support per nom. Egsan Bacon (talk) 23:04, 26 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
This kind of a reading of https://wikinav.toolforge.org/?language=en&title=Buttigieg is too superficial, I've been arguing against this for many months now, cf. WT:D as well... Right now we see there were 820 views of Buttigieg in March, and the system identified 172 outgoing views of Pete from there. This is actually a ratio of ~21%. In other words, ~79% of views of the surname list did not result in a visit to Pete Buttigieg. That means there's an obvious risk that, if we short-circuit, we get some substantial portion of readers -- who didn't really want to go there -- confused or astonished.

Now this ratio can come from a variety of factors, one of the obvious ones is that our anthroponymy lists are sorted alphabetically by default, and this is inherently detrimental for quick navigation to items whose names start with later letters like P. The guideline to apply there would be MOS:DABCOMMON, so we sort Pete and possibly others at the top.

I like that you went into Google Scholar, because this could be indicative of long-term significance, but I really don't like that the concept of long-term significance wasn't even discussed at all. You need to provide a coherent argument why the usage and significance of the single politician would eclipse the combined significance of all the others to such an extent that there is no risk of a primary redirect astonishing many average English readers. (Oppose)

It would be helpful to compare with other possibly similar cases, such as why would Buttigieg redirect, if e.g. Albright or McGovern don't. --Joy (talk) 07:50, 1 May 2024 (UTC)Reply

Oppose look, the guy is a lot less objectionable than many American politicians, but I think this is recentism bias—although he was in the news when running for president, his actual impact on the United States is limited. (t · c) buidhe 01:59, 14 May 2024 (UTC)Reply

Discussion

Note: WikiProject Anthroponymy and WikiProject Malta have been notified of this discussion. ASUKITE 14:39, 24 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

[1] In the two years prior to March 2021, Secretary Buttigieg was often in the headlines of American media for multiple reasons. These included running for President of the United States, campaigning in 2020 on behalf of Joe Biden, and becoming the first LGBT+ individual to become a White House cabinet secretary. Consequently, comparing page views before March 2021 is problematic because of the influence of WP:RECENTISM and WP:BIAS on the data.

[2] The article's subject is the husband of Secretary Buttigieg.

[Claudette-3] 1 2 3 4 Claudette Buttigieg is a redirect to Claudette Pace. The page views provided are the sum of the views to the redirect article and target article.

[4] The article's subject is the father of Secretary Buttigieg.

[Simone-5] 1 2 Simone Buttigieg is a redirect to List of Malta women's international footballers. The page views provided are for the redirect article only.

[6] No date restrictions were used when compiling these search results.

[AnthonyMiddle-7] 1 2 Anthony is the middle name of Joseph Buttigieg. To eliminate search results for Joseph Buttigieg, the search command "anthony buttigieg" - joseph was used.

[8] The article's subject is the husband of Secretary Buttigieg.

[Claudette-9] 1 2 3 4 Claudette Buttigieg is a redirect to Claudette Pace. The results provided are the sum of the results of the individual search commands "claudette buttigieg" and "claudette pace".

[John-10] 1 2 3 4 The search command "john buttigieg" was used to find results for this individual and does not account for Wikipedia's disambiguation. Consequently, some of the relevant scholarly mentions may be for other people.

[11] The article's subject is the father of Secretary Buttigieg.

[AnthonyFirst-12] 1 2 To eliminate search results for Anthony Buttigieg, the search command "joseph buttigieg" - anthony was used.

[Simone-13] 1 2 Simone Buttigieg is a redirect to List of Malta women's international footballers. The search results were obtained using the search command "simone buttigieg" and do not account for the latter title.

[14] The article's subject is the husband of Secretary Buttigieg.

[Claudette-15] 1 2 3 4 Claudette Buttigieg is a redirect to Claudette Pace. The count provided is the sum of the incoming page links to the redirect article and target article.

[16] The article's subject is the father of Secretary Buttigieg.

[Pete-17] 1 2 The count provided for Pete Buttigieg was calculated in intervals of 500 page links.

[Simone-18] 1 2 Simone Buttigieg is a redirect to List of Malta women's international footballers. The count provided is for the redirect article only.

[Diacritic-19] 1 2 3 The source for this table's rankings does not use the acute accent for this surname.

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